Help me understand these trucks

[natesparling]

So my name is Nate, I am a mechanical engineering major in Montana. Previous to this upcoming weekend I have owned a 2006 Hyundai Tiburon and then my current car my 2003 Mitsubishi Evo 8 and my daily which is a 2007 Subaru Legacy. Needless to say I have never owned anything old nor have I ever owned a truck. 

So I have loved these things since I was little, minitrucks have always fascinated me. Fast forward to today where I closed the deal to go pick up a 1976 Datsun 620 about 350 miles away (will be trailering). So after agreeing to a price of $800 I have been doing some research. First off it was lifted, something that I kinda want to reverse, kinda looking to go the lower route. It's also a 4-wheel drive, which to my understanding wasn't available in the 620? So what am I buying here? It looks like a 620 but apparently only the 720 had a 4-wheel drive option? And how would I go about reversing the lift?

 

Thanks for the help guys!

 

[datzenmike]

You could order a 620 through the dealer who would send it away to a conversion company (one or two on each coast) who would add Jeep transfer case and front axle. It's not anything to do with Nissan I believe. The first factory 4x4 (well, beside the Patrol) was the '80-'86.5 720. If you have a solid front axle you have the conversion. If IFS it's a 620 body on a 720 frame.

 

There's not much use for a lowered 4x4.  

[natesparling]

You could order a 620 through the dealer who would send it away to a conversion company (one or two on each coast) who would add Jeep transfer case and front axle. It's not anything to do with Nissan I believe. The first factory 4x4 (well, beside the Patrol) was the '80-'86.5 720. If you have a solid front axle you have the conversion. If IFS it's a 620 body on a 720 frame.

 

There's not much use for a lowered 4x4.  

 Is it just too much work to try to lower that it makes it not worth it or how does that go? I plan to enjoy it for how it is right now but I do really like lowered cars haha.

[racerx]

I think it looks cool the way it is but why u want to lower a 4 x 4? , u sure its a 4 x 4?

[natesparling]

I think it looks cool the way it is but why u want to lower a 4 x 4? , u sure its a 4 x 4?

Yeah the pics of the interior show the selector down on the ground. It looks rather OEM like it's been there since the car was there ya know?

 

As far as why I want to lower it. I just really like the look of lowered 620's. If this car was one of the converted since day 1 sort of models would the leaf spring be under the axel just like on regular 2wd 620's so to lower it I could just get some lowering blocks or how would I go about it?

 

[abbylind]

Too bad your not closer....Id love a 4X4...

[natesparling]

Too bad your not closer....Id love a 4X4...

I'm definitely going to have some fun with it for a while! Who knows, maybe I'll fall in love with the lifted 4x4 world and keep it that way, lord knows me evo is low enough :P Figured I would ask to see if it was even possible to lower however.

[]2eDeYe]

Welcome, nice score. That looks like a pretty straight truck with factory paint. 

 

It will have Jeep CJ style suspension (leaf spring), a Dana 30 front axle and a Dana 20 transfer case. 

 

If you want a lowered 620 you are better off finding one that has not been converted to 4 wheel drive. 

 

 

 

I personally think everyone should have one of each. :)

 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Nice truck!

 

If you want a lower or lowered truck, start with a 2wd truck. PLEASE do not hack into this truck! Dealer conversions are super rare and it would be a shame to see someone start hacking into one of the few surviving 620 4x4's.

 

The dealer probably didn't lift it for the cool factor. They undoubtedly built it as low as they could without having to do any cutting on the frame. I build 4x4's for a living and taller is not more expensive. Taller is cheaper, because it's easier to build them tall to clear the steering links, and to get enough axle to diff clearance.

 

If you don't want a 4x4, I'll buy it from you and you can go get a 2wd.

 

Welcome to Ratsun.

[natesparling]

Starting to sound like I will be learning to love the lifted 4x4 life haha! Thats perfectly okay with me. Would rather not destroy something rare like this. That means I shall go into full resto mode! I want to fix the body, (the one dent in it) and remove any rust (only one real rust hole in it is under the driver footwell) and then coat the underside to prevent it in the further! Also want to make the interior nice and new! Any other recommendations? The truck does start but does not drive, the throttle is not connected and brakes are not installed I guess. I am picking it up on Saturday so I will update you all more then!

[racerx]

Maybe u could do a trade with someone looking for a 4 x 4. Yeh, these vehicle are becoming like rare, in some cases very rare.

[natesparling]

Maybe u could do a trade with someone looking for a 4 x 4. Yeh, these vehicle are becoming like rare, in some cases very rare.

Ehh I'll learn to love it. It's different and its rare. It's got 148,000 on the body and 48,000 with receipts on the motor. Only one dent in the car in the front passenger fender. Pretty clean little truck, and all for $800 with two other sets of tires and the original wheels? Heck yeah.

[]2eDeYe]

The brakes are likely stock 620 brakes, depending on who did the conversion. Also depending on the front axle, dis brakes may be an easy swap. 

 

Some pictures will help identify what you are working with. :)

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

So the dealers installed Jeep axles from what? A full size Jeep? How many spindle bolts are on those knuckles? 5 or 6? If 5 then only Ford and Jeep brakes will work. If 6 then Chevy and Dodge. I can't tell from the pic he provided, but it looks like a fairly long 6 lug wheel hub. Were these all 6 lug conversions?

 

Not that this has anything to do with the owner's plan for the truck. I'm just trying to get an idea of the actual lineage of these dealer conversions. If we can help him identify the parts, then maybe it will be easier for him to get it back on the road.

 

I would love to see some detailed pics of the front axle, rear axle, front and rear brakes, leaf springs and hangers, steering links, steering box, trans and t-case.

[natesparling]

The brakes are likely stock 620 brakes, depending on who did the conversion. Also depending on the front axle, dis brakes may be an easy swap. 

 

Some pictures will help identify what you are working with. :)

 

So the dealers installed Jeep axles from what? A full size Jeep? How many spindle bolts are on those knuckles? 5 or 6? If 5 then only Ford and Jeep brakes will work. If 6 then Chevy and Dodge. I can't tell from the pic he provided, but it looks like a fairly long 6 lug wheel hub. Were these all 6 lug conversions?

 

Not that this has anything to do with the owner's plan for the truck. I'm just trying to get an idea of the actual lineage of these dealer conversions. If we can help him identify the parts, then maybe it will be easier for him to get it back on the road.

 

I would love to see some detailed pics of the front axle, rear axle, front and rear brakes, leaf springs and hangers, steering links, steering box, trans and t-case.

Will definitely get those pictures on Saturday when I pick the truck up. The brakes aren't installed to my knowledge. He's got all brand new parts for the front and rear drum brakes but did not install them. He also hasn't got a throttle installed. That's why the truck doesn't drive. It starts, but it doesn't drive.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Oh, so you've got new brake parts. That will make it easy.

 

Yeah, post up as many pics as possible. I'd love to help.

 

]2ediYe)fjCj5WTf has a lot of working knowledge on these, so it's good to have him along. I just don't get his username...

[sebpv]

Red Eye

]2eD eYe

]2eDeYe

[]2eDeYe]

So the dealers installed Jeep axles from what? A full size Jeep? How many spindle bolts are on those knuckles? 5 or 6? If 5 then only Ford and Jeep brakes will work. If 6 then Chevy and Dodge. I can't tell from the pic he provided, but it looks like a fairly long 6 lug wheel hub. Were these all 6 lug conversions?

 

Not that this has anything to do with the owner's plan for the truck. I'm just trying to get an idea of the actual lineage of these dealer conversions. If we can help him identify the parts, then maybe it will be easier for him to get it back on the road.

 

I would love to see some detailed pics of the front axle, rear axle, front and rear brakes, leaf springs and hangers, steering links, steering box, trans and t-case.

 

 

The guys doing the swaps typically ordered a Dana 30 direct from Dana (as close as I can guess). Most of the ones I have seen are converted to the Datsun stock brakes. The one on my truck, which I believe was originally done by NW ATV, had Dana 44 flat top knuckles and outer axle shafts.

 

A nice upgrade over what my stock CJ has, makes going to disc brakes super simple. 

 

Low MFG did a different version with a custom aluminum center section. I have pics, but have never seen one in person. 

 

The transfer cases were the same deal, ordered direct from Dana with whichever style shifter.

 

There were a bunch of shops that did the conversions, 2 that I know of in the NW so you'd need the tag to help identify the builder. The conversion parts might hold some clues as well.

 

I have seen quite a few of these old converted 4x4's 620s and most of them have had some sort of fab fixes on the swapped stuff. Most of those not done very well. 

 

 

 

As said before, pictures will help identify the components used.. 

 

 

 

Oh, so you've got new brake parts. That will make it easy.

 

Yeah, post up as many pics as possible. I'd love to help.

 

]2ediYe)fjCj5WTf has a lot of working knowledge on these, so it's good to have him along. I just don't get his username...

 

 

It's Redeye, it's derived from my old VW bus that was dubbed 'The Redeye Express' due to night time road tripping to keep the temps down. Then I L33Ted (elited) it for my Counterstrike name CB_]2eDeYe  

 

Sorry for the hijack lol 

[]2eDeYe]

 

 

 

This pic has me curious now.. Those aren't Dana 20 twin stick controls as far as I can tell. 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

As far as I know, Chevy and Dodge were the only MFG's to use flat tops, so I'm assuming it has standard Chevy outers with six bolt spindles. There were about three different Chevy spindle and hub setups (short, long, HD) that I know of. Standard Chevy disc brakes ought to be an easy upgrade, if it doesn't have them already.

 

Does your have high steer? or are you using the cast in steering arm?

 

I'm also assuming these were spring over, so it would need some sort of crossover steering. I wonder what they used for steering boxes.

 

Aluminum center section...? Maybe with Nissan gears?

 

Maybe I'll change my name to )\/(qtt $t0[-[-}23g3n so I can keep up with all you 20 year olds

[]2eDeYe]

As far as I know, Chevy and Dodge were the only MFG's to use flat tops, so I'm assuming it has standard Chevy outers with six bolt spindles. There were about three different Chevy spindle and hub setups (short, long, HD) that I know of. Standard Chevy disc brakes ought to be an easy upgrade, if it doesn't have them already.

 

Does your have high steer? or are you using the cast in steering arm?

 

I'm also assuming these were spring over, so it would need some sort of crossover steering. I wonder what they used for steering boxes.

 

Aluminum center section...? Maybe with Nissan gears?

 

Maybe I'll change my name to )\/(qtt $t0[-[-}23g3n so I can keep up with all you 20 year olds

 

 

Mine are chevy style 6 bolt. I am using wagoneer hubs and brake components. 

 

 

Here is before tear down. That is a custom 6 bolt hub to fit the Datsun drum and the backing plate is rotated to clear the ball joints. 

 

 

 

 

 

And the same knuckle on my Wagoneer Dana 44. Spring over, high/crossover steering with a Toyota IFS Steering box.  

 

 

 

 

The conversions I've seen used the stock steering box. This leads to some interesting booty fab from time to time. This was the drag link I pulled from mine. :sick:  

 

 

 

 

 

The Low MFG diff was Dana 30 guts, not sure why the custom center other than weight savings maybe. 

 

I'm like 43. :rofl:

[natesparling]

 

Small update on the truck (more to come tomorrow as it is still sitting in the trailer and am in my house in my college town and not in my parents home where I am staying for the summer.)

 

So I bought the truck for $800. The car was bought by a Richard and Kathleen E for $6,100 on June 21st 1977 in Great Falls Montana with a monstrous 8 miles on it. It then made the trip to Bozeman Montana where it stayed in their possession for 40 years. The engine was rebuilt at 92,841 miles by (the name of the shop and all receipts are in the car I would have to check the name. Today it has 148,xxx on it with a notebook sitting in the glove box of every single oil change ever performed on it. Original documentation as well as the dealer information is also in the truck (seriously more detailed than I have explained here, I still have more to go through). Anything you could want to know is in there.

 

I am now the second owner of this truck (the original title is in the truck). It fires up without a second guess and it was driven into the trailer (throttle isn't connected so the idle was raised and the clutch let out.) and stopped by killing the engine (no brakes, sitting in a milk crate in the passenger side.) The truck came with 3 sets of tires, 3 sets of rims and a spare. (not sure if there is a spare under the bed?) The truck also has a new clutch and some other new parts. The lights work, all the gauges work (except the fuel gauge [Will need help with this]). It also is going to need most of the rubber pieces around the truck (rubber doesn't last 41 years  :rofl: )

 

After we drove the truck into the trailer and I counted out eight big ones to the young guy that was selling it to me then asked if I wanted to see his 280z, (we had been talking about my Evo 8 previously). We walk over to a "garage" on a dirt driveway built out of tarps draped over metal bars. Inside is a blue old 280z and a small tool box. And in the 280z? An Vortec LS with a 66mm turbo strapped to it. 

Easily one of the craziest things I have ever seen, built in a tarp garage with no more than a little tool box on a dirt driveway. 

 

As I stated above, I own a 2003 Mitsubishi Evo 8 that has been proffessionally painted and is making about 400 at the wheels. A decent car that is about as immaculate as it goes but today, this little $800 datsun is easily the coolest way I have spent $800. To learn the history of the car and the people who owned it, to be the second owner of a car that averaged 3,700 miles a year, has been amazing. Its been a crazy day. Tomorrow morning me and the girlfriend are packing up and heading back to Billings where I plan to get the brakes installed and the throttle hooked up and get the thing driving tomorrow. 

I would love all of you to ask any questions you have. This is the first car I have ever owned that was built before 2003 so I don't know much about old cars or what information people know about them but this is easily the most complete car I have seen. There is so much information here I am just absolutely speechless although I am probably over reacting. 

[hobospyder]

closest i've been to second owner of any vehicle would be my 1996 s10 and that's third owner. next up would be my black golf, i'm fifth owner on that and the p.o. actually totalled the damn thing. 

 

get it running and drive the shit out of it. enjoy.

 

keep all paperwork and add to it

[]2eDeYe]

As a well maintained original owner truck I bet it hasn't had many questionable repairs made. B)

 

 

Once you get it to a good spot, put it on some jackstands, pull the wheels off and get some good pictures of the axles and transfer case area. Then we will be to identify all the components so you know what you are working with. Most maintenance parts should be readily available.  

 

 

That Z is badass  :devil:

[natesparling]

I will get those photos. Axle in the front looks solid though. 

 

Are there any full write ups on replacing the front and rear drum brakes? I can't find anything and I am having one hell of a time with this. All I can find is on disc conversions. 

Also any write ups on connecting everything up to the carb? The throttle isn't currently connected.