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Crashtd420

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If running points 1.2 to 1.43 coil resistance, BUT you must use a ballast resistor, external or inside the coil. Factory ballast resistors are 1.3 to 1.7 ohms. Generally you want a total of 2.5 to 3.0 ohms. The lower the resistance the more output but this will overheat the coil and burn out the points sooner. With the alternator charging at 14 volts a 2.5 ohm points coil is drawing about 5.6 amps with resulting spark to match.

 

Only way to avoid this is an electronic ignition that has about .8 to 1.0 ohms total resistance and there are no points to wear.  With 14 volts a 1 ohm electronic ignition and coil can theoretically draws 14 amps. Close to 3 times as much and a higher output. Note however that the EI module has current limiting circuitry that prevent's damage if an even lower resistance coil is used. It also shuts off if the ignition is left ON and not started and the dwell time is increased with RPM to maintain peak output.

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I have run matchbox distributors since the late 70s with the stock matchbox coil and no ballast resistor.  In all this time I had 1 matchbox die and that was because I wired it wrong.  I have not had a factory coil go bad.

 

Now I remember all the Accel coils and distributors I purchased and ran on my small block Chevys and this was only to look cool.  I sure did throw a lot of money away back in the day.

Edited by Charlie69
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Well it looks like it was the coil, made it to work today with no miss fire..... see if I can repeat that on the way home.....

I was a little quick to blame the dizzy before realizing what I was seeing on my displays..... 

So is there a part number or availability for a 1.5ohm factory coil? Or an aftermarket brand that isn't garbage?

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So after some discussion in another thread about mounting the coil.... I decided since I cant get a factory coil I would try the red Bosch coil, recommended by distributorguy.....

 

Screenshot_20180718-085245_Chrome.jpg

 

 

I'm gonna ohm my wires tonight also and see what they read, he said make sure they are less than 2000 ohm... 

 

Also he recommended non resistor plugs.....

So if recommended is the br6es at the parts store.... is the b6es what I'm looking for as a non resistor plug?

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Nice. You got it figured out.

 

Yes, the B6ES is not a resistor plug. I can't tell you how many resistor plugs I've taken out of customers cars over the years (and thrown away). Same with projected tip plugs and fancy split electrode or three electrode plugs. These old Nissan motors just like simple plain old spark plugs (in the right heat range of course).

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2 hours ago, Crashtd420 said:

Also he recommended non resistor plugs.....

So if recommended is the br6es at the parts store.... is the b6es what I'm looking for as a non resistor plug?

 

Yes, exactly.

 

If I recall, the resistor was to keep the spark plugs "quiet," and from causing noise in the AM radio. 

Edited by mainer311
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18 minutes ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

Nice. You got it figured out.

 

Yes, the B6ES is not a resistor plug. I can't tell you how many resistor plugs I've taken out of customers cars over the years (and thrown away). Same with projected tip plugs and fancy split electrode or three electrode plugs. These old Nissan motors just like simple plain old spark plugs (in the right heat range of course).

 

My roadster calls for the projected tip (R16). 

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So now that I got the coil and plugs figured out, distributor guy also mentioned  to use a resistor plug wire set with the non resistor plug.... 

If the bosch plug wires I'm using ohm out good do I need the resistor wire set? 

I don't have a radio, is there any other reason for the resistor part of the wires or plug?

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40 minutes ago, mainer311 said:

I'm not sure why you'd want higher resistance at all. If the voltage stays the same, your current drops. 

 

FWIW, I run NGK wires on NGK plugs. 

 

I honestly don't know, I'm apparently very clueless about all this .. just going by what distributorguy suggested.. 

 

Right now I have resistor plugs with standard wires.... I was reading about the resistance wire set and I think it has to do with the shielding or something... again i really don't know.....

 

I guess like I said if my wires ohm good... I'll run the new bosch coil and some b6es no resistor plugs and see what happens....

 

Would you gap the plugs a little more with my application? I think they come pre gapped at .032.... I was reading I could open that to .040- .042....

 

 

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On 7/18/2018 at 6:15 AM, Crashtd420 said:

Screenshot_20180718-085245_Chrome.jpg

 

On the coil when you get it, take the little brass male wire  plugs off and put an eye terminal on your wires and nut them down.

 

 

 

Edited by Charlie69
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For points, I would go with 0.032" as recommended. Opening the gap just makes it harder to jump the gap and electricity ALWAYS looks for the easiest (shortest) path to ground. The easiest path to ground must be the spark plug gap. If you have an electronic ignition with higher potential output you can gap wider but the cap, rotor and wires must be in good condition.

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6 hours ago, Crashtd420 said:

 

I honestly don't know, I'm apparently very clueless about all this .. just going by what distributorguy suggested.. 

 

Right now I have resistor plugs with standard wires.... I was reading about the resistance wire set and I think it has to do with the shielding or something... again i really don't know.....

 

I guess like I said if my wires ohm good... I'll run the new bosch coil and some b6es no resistor plugs and see what happens....

 

Would you gap the plugs a little more with my application? I think they come pre gapped at .032.... I was reading I could open that to .040- .042....

 

 

Not a good idea, NGK makes a WIDE gap series (example  B6ES 11).  Those you can gap to .043".  Use the wide gap plug only if you have the the right coil.    1.0 ohms or less.     If you wide gap the std plug, it throws the gap angle off.

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On 7/16/2018 at 10:34 PM, Charlie69 said:

Mike in the picture above where you ran the extra cable to the starter solenoid lug, take it back off and hammer the terminal back flat.  then reinstall.  The problem with this set up is the solenoid stud is not long enough to accommodate the 2 large wire terminals and over time the weight of the wires and the thin nut used on the solenoid stud will eventually strip the stud and then you will have to replace the solenoid.

 

I took it off over a week ago and changed how it's mounted.

 

 

49 minutes ago, mainer311 said:

He’s running EI.

 

It's unclear as he mentions looking for a factory coil and the one pictured is 1.8 ohms. This would indicate points.

 

 

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9 hours ago, Doctor510 said:

Not a good idea, NGK makes a WIDE gap series (example  B6ES 11).  Those you can gap to .043".  Use the wide gap plug only if you have the the right coil.    1.0 ohms or less.     If you wide gap the std plug, it throws the gap angle off.

 

Just changed my order from b6es to the b6es-11.... as stated same plug with a .043 gap..... thanks.....

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1 hour ago, mainer311 said:

He has one of those 123 ignition dizzys.

Yup..... they recommend the 3 ohm, said I can use anything from a 1 to 3 ohm coil.... 

I chose the red bosch for quality,  and 1.8 ohm should work nicely.... 

I know doctor510 said 1ohm for the wider gap but hopefully the 1.8ohm will be ok.... 

I've been reading this morning and it looks like I can close the gap by a couple .001 without problem if I need to ...

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Well the ride home yesterday didn't go as good as I hoped.... I had a couple miss fires....

 

Well I discovered a couple things when I got home....

1st, I checked voltage at the coil vs the battery and it was about .5 or so lower... I swapped the relay that feeds the power to the coil and now I have the same voltage at the battery .. I'll probably check the other relays too.....

 

So then I decided to ohm my spark plug wires.... 

The coil to the cap was 4600ohms...

The rest were right around 7000ohm...

Guess a new set of wires will be next....

While I was doing that I happened to notice the stupid ends of the spark plug were slightly unscrewed..... I'm sure that was causing some off my issue....

 

Drove around last night and to work this morning.... so far so good.... see what happens this afternoon....

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3 hours ago, mainer311 said:

He has one of those 123 ignition dizzys.

 

Found it on line. Breaker-less ignition with advance choices. Looks like 1.8 ohm coil suggested, so output should be better than the stock points but would draw twice the current through an EI coil. Doesn't say if it would survive a 1 ohm coil.

 

Try 0.043" gaps but if there is any breakup go back to 0.032" and see if this is the cause.

 

You can run solid wire core or several K ohm resistance per foot which is the norm. Even your current (pun not intended) wires will work just fine if in good shape. Resistance is needed for noise suppression that's all. Solid wire core wires just turn your ignition system into a radio station. 

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This is how they described the kit.... I guess it is good for noise suppression too....

 

"

  • Helically wound conductor suppresses electro and radio noise
  • Kevlar core combination for great strength and durability
  • Heavy duty terminals for secure connection and silicone boots protect against high exhaust temps
  • 8 mm silicone and synthetic jacket resists heat and abrasion
  • 500 ohms per foot resistance for improved spark delivery and power"

 

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