Jump to content

Another 510 auto to manual thread. (need help figuring if I need parts)


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 13
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

You probably already know, but I'll mention it anyway - with a 5-speed swap, the tranny X-member must be spaced down approx one inch, or the center section cut out and welded back in an inch lower, or some method of getting the rear of the 5-speed dropped down so it doesn't hit the tran tunnel (also the holes for the rubber mount need to be in a slightly different position I think). When I put the dogleg in my '72 510 I followed the Dime Quarterly article on making spacers from 1" thick rectangular tubing to go between the floor and the X-member. It took me awhile to figure out the DQ plan was for a 4-speed X-member and wouldn't work with automatic one. Luckily I had a 510 manual trans X-member in my pile of junk.

 

Len

Link to comment
  • 2 weeks later...

i got around to taking pics of the transmissions. the one on the left has two sensors and "1972" written in sharpie. the one on the right only has the one sensor. which would be the one to use?

 

F36A9B75-558E-47C0-993C-FF57BFED0C6B_zps

 

 

Also I'm refurbishing my pedals for the swap and realized the pedals I bought have the top part completely cut off, they can still bolt onto the firewall though, but I haven't prepped them. Are the pedals good to use as is?

 

05443960-7C6A-4F19-9322-50B0539C6A59_zps

Link to comment

To me, these look to be 4-speeds. At least I think I see the square pan on the bottom of each case (below and to the left from the sensors you have circled in the pics). If these are 4-speeds I don't think you need to space the tranny cross member down as I mentioned in my previous post. I assumed you were putting a 5-speed. 4-speed is fine if that is what you have. One thing to check though - some Datsun 4-speeds tend to get stuck in gear when they get a lot of miles on them. Not necessarily anything for you to worry about, but before installing either of these, you should install the shift lever and make sure it goes into all gears and reverse. Turn the shaft at one end and watch the shaft at the other. Just to be sure everything seems to be working correctly. Years ago I came close to installing a stuck-in-4th-gear tranny in my 510 without realizing it had a problem.

 

Probably either tranny will work fine for you. I'm guessing the one with two switches may be the newer, but the number of miles on each is probably more important and you probably can't tell which one has the higher miles. Maybe datzenmike or someone can see a difference. When you refill the one you use, you want to use "yellow metal safe" tranny oil to protect the synchro rings. NAPA did sell a version of this. Again, someone more knowledgeable than the me can give you more details. Measure the trannys to be sure they are the same length as your auto (about 26 1/2" as I recall). There are some 31" long 4-speeds out there. If you have one of those you will need to shorten your drive shaft. The ones in your pic look kind of long, but I can't really tell by looking.

 

I looked at the pedal box on my '72 510. It appears to me the portion of your pedal box that had been cut away is a rather important part. It bolts the box in place under the dash toward the rear of the box. What I would do is unbolt the two pedal arms from the box (Important point - one of these, I believe the brake, uses a left-hand thread. If you turn it the normal direction to loosen you will be tightening it and can twist the bolt off). Then take out the brake pedal arm from the pedal box in your car and install the new clutch and brake pedal arms. Easier than having to remove the pedal box from your car. The only problem is the auto pedal box doesn't have a arm welded on for the clutch return spring to hook to. I just hooked my return spring through a hole somewhere up the pedal box and it has been fine for several years. To hook up that strong spring, I ran a piece of wire from the hook on the spring up beside the steering column to the outside of the dash. I snapped a Vise-grip to the wire and used that to get a good pull on the end of the clutch spring. Also, the gas pedal will be very close to the brake pedal. I've run mine that way for years and I have size 13 feet. But some guys mod the gas pedal to move it over slightly.

 

Len

Link to comment

Be certain there is a bronze pilot bushing in the hole in the rear end of your crankshaft. Even if there is one in there it is a good idea to remove it and put in a new one. It is a really cheap part and not hard to change. A dry pilot bushing makes a horrible noise every time you depress the clutch. You don't want to live with that.

 

Len

  • Like 2
Link to comment

What I would do is unbolt the two pedal arms from the box (Important point - one of these, I believe the brake, uses a left-hand thread. If you turn it the normal direction to loosen you will be tightening it and can twist the bolt off). Then take out the brake pedal arm from the pedal box in your car and install the new clutch and brake pedal arms. Easier than having to remove the pedal box from your car. 

Thanks, damn that explains why when I was trying to remove the brake pedal the bolt tightened instead of loosened even tho I was wrenching to the left. I'll remove the pedals and put them on the auto pedal box and grind off the tab and weld that too. Thanks for that advice

 

Be certain there is a bronze pilot bushing in the hole in the rear end of your crankshaft. Even if there is one in there it is a good idea to remove it and put in a new one. It is a really cheap part and not hard to change. A dry pilot bushing makes a horrible noise every time you depress the clutch. You don't want to live with that.

 

Len

Everything else I have new. Slave cylinder, master cylinder, pilot bearing, throw out bearing, lines, etc.

  • Like 1
Link to comment

I did an auto to 4 spd swap on mine, didn't even have to shorten the drive line, do replace the seal at end of tyranny, I think I paid like $4 at autozone for it.

I've read up as much as I can on the swap, I know I can reuse my auto gas pedal but I have to move it more to the right and bend the throttle arm so it's more like an OEM manual pedal. Did you have to cut a bigger hole where the shifter comes up or is it a perfect fit like an auto stick?

Link to comment

I'm pretty sure you should plan to cut out the shifter hole in the tunnel a little larger. I put a dogleg 5-speed in my 510, not a 4-speed, but they are the same length. As I recall, the auto shifter hole is rather small and rectangular. It is in about the right location for the manual shifter, just not big enough. The 4-speed and dogleg 5-speed use a different style shifter mechanism, but I still imagine the auto hole isn't large enough for either style.

 

I used a metal cutting blade in a sabre/reciprocating saw to cut out my tunnel hole. Some type of nibbler might make a smoother cut, but it is covered by the shift boot so I didn't worry much about the ragged hole I made. If I pull the tranny out someday I'll take a die grinder to the hole so it looks better.

 

You are doing the right thing getting all new clutch components. I'm notoriously cheap, so I went with used pieces I had laying around. Then had to put in a new slave cylinder, followed by a new master cylinder to get the clutch hydraulics working. My used clutch disc and cover isn't especially smooth so it will be next to be replaced. If I'd have started with new parts I wouldn't have to think about it for years. But so far I've had good luck with used alternators and starters so I'll probably keep using them until they leave me walking one day.

 

Len

Link to comment

F36A9B75-558E-47C0-993C-FF57BFED0C6B_zps

 

These are both F4W63L 4 speed transmissions.

 

The left one only has the reverse lamp switch.

The right one has the 3rd gear switch for emissions. (some have a neutral switch just forward of the shifter)

 

You can't put the clutch disc in backwards, but the release bearing can. Flat side to the collar, rounded side to the clutch diaphragm fingers. This is a high wear item that in addition is not easy to replace because of it's location. Don't get the $5 special. Spend the money on a good one.

 

Be sure to pack the small cavity inside the release collar with grease. Very lightly grease the collar contact points where the clutch arm touches it and the pivot ball on the transmission. Lightly grease the slave push rod ends with molybdenum grease.

 

The pilot bushing is a porous sintered bronze. It is oiled and lubricated for life. Greasing it will only attract and collect abrasive clutch disc powder. 

Link to comment

I've read up as much as I can on the swap, I know I can reuse my auto gas pedal but I have to move it more to the right and bend the throttle arm so it's more like an OEM manual pedal. Did you have to cut a bigger hole where the shifter comes up or is it a perfect fit like an auto stick?

Mine had the automatic shifter setup on the steering wheel column, I didn't need to move nor bend anything on the gas pedal, all I did is change the other pedals.

  • Like 1
Link to comment

I appreciate the help from everyone, just one more questions related the the electric components.

 

 

Do I delete this switch on the gas pedal? The switch goes on when I have the gas floored, it kind of acts like an overdrive but I don't know if that's the exact function of it or if I leave it as is. (located under the steering column)

 

 

FEAF050E-5A8D-45C2-9E8D-F9EBE4666271_zps

 

 

Also Do these plug into anything? maybe the wires for a neutral safety switch?

 

 

CEE8EDC6-637D-4FBA-A98F-C4A9BE39DAE3_zps

Link to comment

That is the switch that activate the 'kick down' solenoid in the auto transmission. It selects first or second gear, assuming you are not going too fast for them, for sudden passing acceleration. No sense having a loose wire with power on it.I would disconnect it and save it.

  • Like 2
Link to comment

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.