Jump to content

The honey bucket- 1972 510 4 door build


Recommended Posts

A little more progress today...

 

Got the "new" bumper mount welded in:

67J8NTZl.jpg

 

Not the prettiest thing but much better than before

 

kj8DBXtl.jpg

 

Went ahead and filled some holes while the welder was out. This is where the hitch mounted to:

 

DX2wXVul.jpg

 

Really astonishing 

 

PYeUipOl.jpg?1t

 

Hoping to get the left quarter in tomorrow, should be a little more exciting  :sleep:

Link to comment
  • Replies 65
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Is your gas on? It looks like you don't have any shielding.

 

Ah, it's actually flux core (harbor freight). That combined with my sub-par welding expertise probably explains it... I'm really hoping to get a solid wire mig in the very near future, but $$. Does any one have any remotely positive experience with flux core and body work?

Link to comment

Make sure you have your welders polarity setup correctly for flux core then. It is the reverse of gas shielded settings. The gun should be the negative, the "ground clamp" is the positive for flux core.

 

Welding sheet metal patches is difficult with flux. Proper sheet welding is done with hundreds of overlapped tack welds. Because flux core welds are coated in flux that must be chipped off each time you finish a tack, you will have to lay a set of tacks then go back and clean each of those tacks. Then start over with another run of tacks and then clean again. Rinse and repeat. It can be done, but it's much more time consuming and difficult.

 

Many cheap welders don't turn down far enough to work well on sheet. If you have that problem, look in to using a backing strip behind your seams or at least use a copper welding spoon behind the welds.

  • Like 1
Link to comment

Thanks for the feedback guys. I've done quite a bit of sheet metal work with flux that all turned out decent, but this is a much bigger job and time is money. I've been looking for an excuse to get a real MIG setup so this might be the perfect excuse. 

 

I'll be on the lookout for a miller/lincoln 110V on used CL or the eastwood if I decide to go the new route. 

 

I guess it's time for the dash cluster upgrade -

 

g4twYZEh.jpg?1

  • Like 1
Link to comment
  • 1 month later...

Two months later and I got a "proper" welding settup: a 2000 Miller 130xp, with a C35 tank running 0.023" wire.

OamH6Awl.jpg

 

I've done quite a bit of body work with my flux welder, but I'm still learning how to dial this guy in.

I'm actually pretty disappointed in this unit because I can't really weld at a wire speed below 50. Anything slower and the welder just pops around. The best welds I got were using 2/5 V and 60/100 wire speed. FAR from the factory settings for 20G (1/5V and 30/100 wire speed). Any advice here? I check everything, the wire feeds fine, the metal is clean, the ground is fine, no extensions... Here's some pictures of my first "test" patch.

Bare with me, it's not pretty:

 

oAU3wLBl.jpg?1

 

FP1Fvo7l.jpg?2

After too much grinding:

GGu7Pm8l.jpg

 

I think its obvious the wire speed is too high, but again anything lower and the welder pops around. That "bacon sizzle" only happens at 50+. Is this common with these units?

 

Thanks for looking!

  • Like 1
Link to comment

What kind of gap are you leaving between panels? What gas are you welding with? Is your polarity correct for gas shielded wire?

 

The gap varies, but shooting for about the diameter of the wire (0.023"). Gas is C25 with reverse polarity (DC electrode positive). 

Link to comment

That all sounds pretty good. Have you tried messing with the voltage with low wire speed?

 

I actually have not tried that. I'm a little reluctant to going higher than 2/5 on the voltage with 20G, but I'll give it a shot.

 

Did you buy that setup new or used? Looks like a killer setup!

 

Thanks! I got it used, except for the shiny HF cart a a few little odds and ends.

Link to comment

More voltage, more wire speed. You're too slow and too cold. You're just blowing in spots here, never trying to run a bead.

 

It will take a LOT of practice to get comfortable doing 20 gauge sheet with 0.023 wire and C25-but it's a hell of a lot nicer than 0.030 and C02, and it's a whole world apart from trying to work with flux core...flux core will cause your paint to pop off later, because you just can't get all the flux off the weld.

 

Go to your local welding supply and ask for Harris/Perfect Circle "TwentyGauge" wire. It's got a shotgun shell on the side of the spool, and it's specifically made for body work.

 

DO NOT FLANGE YOUR PANELS! It will make correcting any warpage basically impossible. DON'T DO IT!

 

Line up the panel and use magnets or panel clamps to hold it in place. If you flange the panel, the next bit is impossible and you will have to use a shitload of body filler.

 

The correct (and easiest) way to do panel patches is to cut the edges and line'em up, and set the gap to about the size of the wire-which you seem to be doing. Then, you spot it at each end, and in the middle. Just three spots to start!

 

Then, take a dolly and a hammer and flatten the weld-you will want to practice on some 20g sheet first to learn how hard to hit and how many strikes it will take. The idea is to learn how much you need to hammer the weld to get the spot weld to stretch out enough to restore your gap back to the size of the wire.

 

Check your fitment, make sure it's correct now.

 

Divide the distance between your spot welds in half, and put two more spots in. Hammer them to stretch till the gap is back to wire size.

 

Repeat. Keep the panel bare-hand touchable the entire time-it should never get hot enough to burn you.

 

Once you have the panel welded solid with the spot welds, you take your 4.5" cut-off wheel (do not use a flap disk!) and use the edge of the cut off wheel to grind the weld only. Do not grind the panels, and don't try to get it perfect, you're preparing for the flap disk.

 

Only once you've ground the weld back, do you switch to a flap disk. Use a sharp new one, and a very light touch-used, worn, old ones will actually heat your panel up too much and cause a warp. (You can use that to your advantage if you need to shrink up some places when you fix dents!

 

Once the welding is complete, make absolutely sure you shoot the back side of the weld with a good PAINT. Do not just shoot it in primer and leave it...this goes for weld-thru primer too. It WILL rust later if it's not sealed with paint.

 

Ocassionally you'll get lucky with this method and not need any filler at all, but usually, a skim coat is needed to correct for missed hammer strikes or grind marks.

 

You'll be the man at the "rosette" weld by the time you're done with this project!

 

If you need help with paint products and body prep for paint, just ask-I am currently painting this in between manifolds and drywalling the new workroom on the shop:

 

KIMG0520_zpsilej0xvl.jpg

 

KIMG0566_zpssbvlzz81.jpg

  • Like 2
Link to comment

Hammer welding standard mig wire welds often results in cracking, particularly if you do multiple tacks and then go back to try to hammer them all. They are way too cold at that point. While you might be getting to work well, it is most assuredly not a technique for a beginner to be dealing with.

Link to comment

More voltage, more wire speed. You're too slow and too cold. You're just blowing in spots here, never trying to run a bead.

 

It will take a LOT of practice to get comfortable doing 20 gauge sheet with 0.023 wire and C25-but it's a hell of a lot nicer than 0.030 and C02, and it's a whole world apart from trying to work with flux core...flux core will cause your paint to pop off later, because you just can't get all the flux off the weld.

 

Go to your local welding supply and ask for Harris/Perfect Circle "TwentyGauge" wire. It's got a shotgun shell on the side of the spool, and it's specifically made for body work.

 

DO NOT FLANGE YOUR PANELS! It will make correcting any warpage basically impossible. DON'T DO IT!

 

Line up the panel and use magnets or panel clamps to hold it in place. If you flange the panel, the next bit is impossible and you will have to use a shitload of body filler.

 

The correct (and easiest) way to do panel patches is to cut the edges and line'em up, and set the gap to about the size of the wire-which you seem to be doing. Then, you spot it at each end, and in the middle. Just three spots to start!

 

Then, take a dolly and a hammer and flatten the weld-you will want to practice on some 20g sheet first to learn how hard to hit and how many strikes it will take. The idea is to learn how much you need to hammer the weld to get the spot weld to stretch out enough to restore your gap back to the size of the wire.

 

Check your fitment, make sure it's correct now.

 

Divide the distance between your spot welds in half, and put two more spots in. Hammer them to stretch till the gap is back to wire size.

 

Repeat. Keep the panel bare-hand touchable the entire time-it should never get hot enough to burn you.

 

Once you have the panel welded solid with the spot welds, you take your 4.5" cut-off wheel (do not use a flap disk!) and use the edge of the cut off wheel to grind the weld only. Do not grind the panels, and don't try to get it perfect, you're preparing for the flap disk.

 

Only once you've ground the weld back, do you switch to a flap disk. Use a sharp new one, and a very light touch-used, worn, old ones will actually heat your panel up too much and cause a warp. (You can use that to your advantage if you need to shrink up some places when you fix dents!

 

Once the welding is complete, make absolutely sure you shoot the back side of the weld with a good PAINT. Do not just shoot it in primer and leave it...this goes for weld-thru primer too. It WILL rust later if it's not sealed with paint.

 

Ocassionally you'll get lucky with this method and not need any filler at all, but usually, a skim coat is needed to correct for missed hammer strikes or grind marks.

 

You'll be the man at the "rosette" weld by the time you're done with this project!

 

If you need help with paint products and body prep for paint, just ask-I am currently painting this in between manifolds and drywalling the new workroom on the shop:

 

KIMG0520_zpsilej0xvl.jpg

 

KIMG0566_zpssbvlzz81.jpg

 

Wow, thank you so much for all your advice, this is all news to me. I'll look into getting that wire asap and try it out.

Link to comment

That being said, I've gotten a little bit more work done before your advice: 

sSJQGeml.jpg

This patch was a pain, hence the hammer marks. Good thing no one will actually have to look at this. Its for sure cold. I will attempt to bring up the voltage to 3 on the miller, and just run quicker tacks. Also, the shoot-to-fill smaller rust holes on the right was not the best method. I should have just cut out that section too, but oh well, thats how I learn. I grinded it all down and it looks a little more decent.

 

This was a little more exciting:

IThFQscl.jpg

 

I decided to do a lap weld here. From what I read online it would be the easiest/best method. Here I went up to 3 on the voltage, but I'm still not totally satisfied with these tacks... I still have to do the other side so I'll see if I can get that 20G wire and try a butt weld the second time.

 

LJKT1Idl.jpg

 

It took too many hours to line up but it turned out fine. I sprayed the overlapping section with weld through copper primer hoping to protect that 1/2" of bare sandwiched metal. I think I'll cut out the rest of that trunk floor up to the tire well. Too many salt holes to plug up, might as well start fresh.

 

More progress to come! Thanks everyone for the tips.  B)

 

SaveSave

  • Like 2
Link to comment

That lap weld WILL rust later. Sorry buddy, but that weld-thru primer won't help a bit with the rust...might last an extra year. Also, you will never be able to make adjustments for weld distortion with a hammer and dolly later-the double-layered panel means you can't stretch those welds.

 

Also, because lap welds aren't sealed on the back side of the panel, any body filler you put in will loose adhesion due to moisture later. If you're going to keep the lap joint, make sure you fully weld it, make sure it's sealed up, and seam seal the crap out of it on the inside before you paint it.

 

I used to lap weld stuff, but I have learned over the last 10 years what a mistake it really is.

  • Like 1
Link to comment

Thanks Xnke, I'll make sure to seal this one.

 

More progress... slowly but surely...

 

FG17Sdbl.jpg

 

o9woLDdh.jpg

 

And to think I have to do this all again on the other side...  :sleep: At Least I'm feeling better with the welder settings, seems like more voltage has been doing the trick. 

 

Also revisited some old paper work I saved on the car:

jWCAPBtl.jpg

 

The odometer now reads 12k. I got the car from a friend of the original owner who bought it just to flip it. The tags were dated 2005 when I got it. This along with other mileage paperwork leads me to believe the car indeed only has 112k original miles. Pretty rad. It's a reminder -- she's worth it!

  • Like 1
Link to comment
  • 3 weeks later...

So I need some advice... Working on the right quarter now:

 

Y7U0tQuh.jpg

 

Here's the replacement panel: (it's actually not in great shape and was cut a little sloppy)

 

cBwX0p0l.jpg?1

It looks pretty hacked DIY:

lAAyUHUl.jpg

 

Now, should I replace just the skin? Or do what I did on the other side and replace the trunk floor drops too? This is where I wish I had a futofab floor drop but I don't.

Moar oics:

Fec2Jwpl.jpg

 

I would have to cut out and replace the lower section and maybe a couple other spots:

GBfICiIh.jpg

 

I'm leaning towards keeping the original floor drops since they can be salvaged and the other panel just looks janky. What do you guys think?

 

Thanks!

Link to comment
  • 3 weeks later...

Some progress, decided to just do the rear quarter skin for the right side, and repair the good ol' trunk drop:

 

7zjfQrCl.jpg

 

XdsHjWUh.jpg

 

POR-15-ed:

 

IoTBo7ol.jpg

 

A trunk floor almost complete-

 

XrzAUGSh.jpg

 

Some mock-up action:

 

GF4TFAcl.jpg?1

 

The sun came out so this picture sucks, but at least its starting to look like a real car... almost there  :angel:

  • Like 4
Link to comment

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.