No turning radius in my 510

[datsunfreak]

 

Yes I see now. Shortening the spindle center line to the tie rod distance would make the tire move further with less input steering (course you don't get something for nothing and the effort would increase also) But the tire would still turn the same amount.

 

TANSTAAFL always applies to anything suspension related.   :thumbup:

 

 

 I think he said earlier that the wheels don't travel farther enough...

 

Indeed. Which generally means only one thing. Steering box is fucked.  B)

[datsunfreak]

Also to the people talking about the caliper hitting the tie rod, this can't happen with RCAs. That puts the caliper high enough that it doesn't hit under any circumstance. 

[datzenmike]

 

 

Long shot...
Needs new pads. When worn down the caliper will hit the steering tie rod. As long as the pads are good no problem. The cure is to switch the struts and calipers side to side. This places the caliper to the front. Does it turn ok the other direction? Doubt both are rubbing.

Did you adjust the steering box play? Removing slop in the worn straight ahead position will bind when turned to the unworn sides.

 

Try loosening the box some more and see what happens. 

[iwayman]

So I've read the 280zx knuckles are shorter, will bolt up, and should decrease my radius, however, they will also make it easier to lose control when you hit a bump at speed.  

 

I've backed out the adjustment screw 3 or 4 full turns and that is when I saw a slight increase in the number of steering wheel turns to lock to the left.

 

After reading what everyone has said, I once again am leaning towards the steering box being worn out.

 

I've pulled info from this thread, too http://community.ratsun.net/topic/38745-510-suspension-questions/

and http://www.the510realm.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=12637&start=135

 

 

 

A lot of this may be moot, since the OP doesn't really seem to be responding or effectively answering questions people have asked of him...   :rofl:

 

As a full-time college student with part-time job and this 510 as my only means of transportation, it's pretty difficult to work on the car and attempt to problem shoot each suggestion without risking the car being down for a couple days at a time.

[datsunfreak]

As a full-time college student with part-time job and this 510 as my only means of transportation, it's pretty difficult to work on the car and attempt to problem shoot each suggestion without risking the car being down for a couple days at a time.

 

No worries. Just too used to guys asking questions then never coming back...   ^_^

[datzenmike]

 

As a full-time college student with part-time job and this 510 as my only means of transportation, it's pretty difficult to work on the car and attempt to problem shoot each suggestion without risking the car being down for a couple days at a time.

 

It's datsunfreak's 'moon time'

[iwayman]

I have a week off coming up in a couple weeks.  I will be able to play around with the steering then, however, I will probably end up switching out steering boxes with my other dime back in Oregon and replacing a couple front end bushings along with my tie rod ends and ball joints with some fresh moog parts for peace of mind.  

 

And I do have access to the steering knuckles on an 83 zxt, are the shorter knuckles worth the extra angle considering the increased chance of bumping the steering out on the road?  And does the zxt take 14mm ball joints?

 

 

What are some other steering options in the 510s? I think I read datzenmike post somewhere that HL510 steering boxes work. I've also read that 210 boxes might fit.

 

I'm planning on auto-crossing this come spring at some local events and i'm sure a rack and pinion would be pretty nice.

Have there been any builds that swap in a 240z front crossmember to fit a rack and pinion?  

Would mounting a rack be pretty difficult when I have a flipped crossmember to fit a front sump?  I'm pretty sure I have an MR-2 rack floating around at home.

[datsunfreak]

And I do have access to the steering knuckles on an 83 zxt, are the shorter knuckles worth the extra angle considering the increased chance of bumping the steering out on the road?  And does the zxt take 14mm ball joints?

 

Turbo and non-turbo is all the same stuff. It does take 14mm ball joints, but I would suggest using the 280ZX ball joints if doing this mod. People have been known to break the stock ball joints with 280ZX knuckles. 

 

What are some other steering options in the 510s? I think I read datzenmike post somewhere that HL510 steering boxes work. I've also read that 210 boxes might fit.

 

They're all pretty much the same, just different ratios. I've used a B210 box and a 210 box in a 510. Both bolted right in. 

 

Have there been any builds that swap in a 240z front crossmember to fit a rack and pinion?  

 

Yes, but the one I'm thinking of just used the entire 240Z front suspension/crossmember/etc.

 

Would mounting a rack be pretty difficult 

 

Yes.  ^_^

[q-tip]

I'm running the zx knuckles on my dime, no real bumpsteer issues no binding and amazingly enough no bumpsteer spacers.

[datsunfreak]

I'm running the zx knuckles on my dime, no real bumpsteer issues no binding and amazingly enough no bumpsteer spacers.

 

510 or ZX ball joints?

[iwayman]

Turbo and non-turbo is all the same stuff. It does take 14mm ball joints, but I would suggest using the 280ZX ball joints if doing this mod. People have been known to break the stock ball joints with 280ZX knuckles. 

 

 

 

 

280zx ball joints don't have a three-bolt design?

 

https://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=203931&cc=1209406

 

compared to the classic four-bolt

https://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=203652&cc=1209989

 

 

So would you drill out the lower control arm to mount the zx ball joint?

And does the zx knuckle some how put more stress on the stock ball-joint?

[datsunfreak]

So would you drill out the lower control arm to mount the zx ball joint?

 

I would weld on a steel plate to the stock LCA and drill new holes. Also bear in mind the stock T/C rod uses two of the bolts in the stock ball joint. It's not really a "Bolt-in" solution, mind you...    ^_^

 

 

And does the zx knuckle some how put more stress on the stock ball-joint?

 

I would assume so? No one seems to know exactly why it breaks the ball joint, just that it does. 

 

I'd assume that changing the leverage on it increases the stress on it. But I can't swear to that...

 

Seems like a fool's errand anyway just because there are boxes out there with slightly better ratios in them, so...  

[datzenmike]

And does the zx knuckle some how put more stress on the stock ball-joint?

 

 

I doubt it. Never heard that stock 510 ball joints break if you run zx struts and/or knuckles. Other than the obvious smaller being weaker than larger, (if they break, not saying they do) it's likely the 14 inch and up 6,7, 8" wide rims and sticky tires, monster brakes, sway bars and driving faster and harder on a ball joint designed for a 45 years old 60 MPH passenger economy car riding on 5.60 X 13 4 ply tires.

[datsunfreak]

I doubt it. Never heard that stock 510 ball joints break if you run zx struts and/or knuckles. 

 

Just to clarify, it's never the struts, just the knuckles. 

[q-tip]

510 or ZX ball joints?

14mm 510 ball joints.

[thisismatt]

Are you guys sure it's the ball joints susceptible to breaking? I thought it was the outer tie rod balls, because the zx arm has the taper hole at a fairly different angle and can max out the 510 tie rod ball articulation. If it is the ball joint, I could see that as well given that the offset to the strut axis is also different, so with zx knuckles and 510 shorter control arm geometry, the ball may be reaching its limits at some point.

[datsunfreak]

Are you guys sure it's the ball joints susceptible to breaking? 

 

I've never seen it. Just heard tons of guys on the BB email list saying it does. Take that with a grain of salt. 

 

People may just be regurgitating shit they heard as well. Like me.   :rofl:

[thisismatt]

Yeah...I've never seen it, but remember people talking about it on the realm years ago.  I had some zx arms at one point...might still have them somewhere.  I took pictures showing some of the differences back then.  As you can see, the ball joint offset is different from stock 510, and the tie rod taper hole is a much different angle.  The more centered ball joint hole draws the strut inward farther

 

 

 

[iwayman]

After hearing all this about the knuckles, I'm tempted to try them out to see how they feel.  If anything looks like it's getting maxed out or is binding then it would make sense to swap back to stock knuckles.  

 

I think Datzenmike brings up a good point about the components not being engineered to maintain rough driving in general and many of the people swapping to the zx knuckles could be skewing the sample group if most of them are swapping to get more performance.