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Release Bearing collar (throwout bearing collar) selection


tr8er

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Okay, I have a question that I have found answered in several places with varying degrees of obfuscation.  If you are a clutch guru with the willingness to cover this repeating topic of confusion, please do.  

 

I've learned through other forums that you must match the throwout collar with the pressure plate.  The distance between the bearing and the fins on the pressure plate is determined by these two items, and this distance should be between minimal to zero for best clutch action.  Pressing on those fins with any pressure is bad and will kill your bearing under normal operation.  So generally, if you keep your throwout bearing and collar and order a clutch kit for your year car and transmission, you should be fine.  Order another years clutch kit, and you may end up with the wrong size pressure plate, and your clutch may not work.  

 

It seems to me this community would greatly benefit from any soul who could put together a size chart that we could reference for sizing.  I would even take this on if the information was available to me.  

 

My question is this.  I have neither the pressure plate, nor the throwout collar.  So the options are all there for me.  I would like to open the forum to your opinions on what setups are great, and what isn't.  What is geared towards sport (200mm roadster), and what is geared for traffic.  Opinions, links, specs, pictures are all welcome.   

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Mine is an "un-matched" setup, but it works well with no issues:  1980 L20B, 1982 ZX 5spd and 240mm throw-out bearing/collar, 1976 610 225mm flywheel (new off the internet) lightened to 17lbs, 240sx 225mm Exedy clutch/pressure plate.    I only recently read that you should match the collar and bearing to the clutch/p.p., but like I said, It works fine.

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I like the setup.  The clutch is a stage one (OEM) for spirited daily driving.  I went with the 225mm because I didn't want the extra extended mass of the 240mm.  I think the flywheel was around 23 or 24 lbs when I took it to the shop to be cut down.  I knew I didn't want the 11 or 13 lb aluminum flywheel for street driving, but at the time, I also didn't realize you can add weight to those.  I got my flywheel from here: http://www.autopartsexpress.com/ShopByVehicle.epc?q=1976-NISSAN/DATSUN-610-L4--1952cc--2.0l--2--Bbl--Vin--L20b&yearid=1976%40%401976&makeid=60%40%40NISSAN%2FDATSUN%40%40B&modelid=3295%40%40610&engineid=11197@@L4-1952cc%202.0L%202%20BBL%20Vin%20L20B@@11197&catid=10@@Exhaust%2FClutch&subcatid=159@@Flywheel&mode=PA but they aren't showing it for sale right now.  It cost me $76 shipped, versus the $300-odd for the aluminum flywheels.

 

**Note;  I first tried the 240sx flywheel on the L20B, but it didn't fit.  The bore in the flywheel for the crankshaft was too large of a diameter, and was loose around the crankshaft "snout".   I took the 240sx flywheel in with me to the machine shop so they could use it as a reference when cutting the 610 flywheel.  The 240sx flywheel was lighter and was cast with a lot less mass in the middle, toward the center.

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I'm currently having this issue with my dime.....

 

....problem is....I'm not sure what year my tranny is out of......I'm guessing somewhere between 80-83....

 

I bought the collar that goes with the tranny......centerforce stage 2 clutch.....L16 flywheel...

 

Slave is adjusted to the end and it's engaging near the top....no free play either....

 

....when I go for long drives....heat expands things and it will sometimes start to slip....

 

.....I'm assuming I need the short collar.

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L16 uses a 200mm flywheel set up so you use the stock 510/521 colloar and t/o bearing.

trans dont matter.

I assume the kit is a 200mm since it fit the flywhell but do NOT come with a collar as I have seen

 

 

this is just me But I would use the stock 510 throwout arm from the trans that has the hole and use the 510 slave set up. the threaded rod with the ball as its more adjustable.

the later trans use the arm with the dimple and uses the slave with the coorect size rod which is shorter. the slave itself is pretty much the same.

this is from my trans swap from a stock 4 speed to a 200sx77-79 5 speed.

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It was my understanding the pressure plate, bearing and collar have to match your flywheel size.  When I installed my clutch recently I used all 200mm roadster parts and mistakenly used the collar that came with the ZX trans I was installing, and I had an automatic trans to begin with so I didnt have a reference.  The 200mm collar is noticeably "shorter" than the 225mm when placed side by side, I corrected it and hasnt had a problem since.  As far as drive-ability goes, I was worried about it being a little rough, being my first daily with a standard trans, but it has turned out to be a blast!  510s are so light that I find the extra clamping pressure doesnt effect pedal action as negatively as I thought it would, instead it seems to simply provide more control of the power distribution.  Admittedly, I didnt know there were different variants to the 200mm and 225/240 hardware until I saw that post, thought all 200mm stuff matched and all 225/240mm stuff matched.  I am glad I got a "kit" that matched my hardware for me.

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The clutch and pressure plate diameter used is subject to the bolt pattern on the flywheel. For example a 225mm clutch will not bolt to a flywheel designed for a 240mm or a 200mm pressure plate. Calling a flywheel a 225mm means only that it takes a 225mm pressure plate.

 

You can however swap the flywheel to change clutch sizes but under one condition. The L16 and L18 crankshafts have 5 mounting bolt holes for the flywheel. All larger L20B, L six cylinder and Z series engines are 6 bolt hole.

 

200mm, 225mm and 240mm clutche and PPs are available.

 

All L16s were 200mm.

L18s were also 200mm but one year only 620 trucks were 5 bolt and 225mm.

 

Flywheels above this line cannot interchange with these bellow the line although some clutch and PPs can

 

Car L20B and Z20 were 200mm

Truck L20Bs and all truck/car Z22s were 225mm

Truck Z20 and Z24 4x4s were 240mm

(after 45 years or so, almost any combination of the above could be found. I found a 240mm flywheel on an L20B once)

 

Generally the larger the clutch diameter the higher the pressure plate release or diaphragm fingers are above the flywheel surface. In order to keep the clutch arm working through the same mechanical leverage point the release collar is varied in length to compensate for the increased or decreased finger height. A 'shorter' 200mm finger height uses a 'longer' release collar than a 'taller' finger 225mm release collar. This way the same slave cylinder, push rod and clutch arm can work in the same position.

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  • 3 years later...

I have been following this thread and quite a few others on release bearings and transmission swaps. The above chart with sizes is very helpful however, I have a couple questions that I am hoping someone can answer for me......first off, I have a '76 620 with an L20, 225mm flywheel/clutch and a 5 speed out of a 280. When I recently pulled the engine to replace the rear main seal, I noticed the pressure plate "fingers" had small score marks on them and figured this was because I had the wrong collar on the release bearing. I don't have the old transmission anymore so can't swap there. Went to the local autoparts store and gave them 30501-N1600 (225mm after '74) as referenced in the chart above which referenced SKF N3052 Bearing Assembly. When I compared this new bearing to the stock one I removed from the 280 transmission, the overall height is the same, however the collar is longer on the new one.....so long story short, my question is this;

 

Why would the collar on the new bearing be longer but the overall height the same? Does this matter? Would anybody happen to know how long in mm the collar for a '76 620 4 speed is? Or lastly am I just totally out to lunch and not understanding the concept of a release bearing??

 

Thanks in advance!

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The clutch diaphragm fingers will show some marking from the release bearing pushing against them, that's normal. A failed or failing bearing may cause some extra wear but they are usually very noisy when used and you will know it.

 

 

The collar is matched to the pressure plate used and has ZERO to do with the transmission or engine used.

 

If your set up works, my advice is to leave it alone. Only the bearing needs replacing. The correct release bearing is Nissan # 30502-21000 and works on just about every Datsun and Nissan from '68 up. It's even used on the 300zx turbo and at least up into the 2000s on the Pathfinder. It's easier to list what it wasn't used on.

 

IMG_7266.jpg

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So a little scuffing is normal....OK, that's good to know. I haven't actually driven the truck with the 5 speed in it, only shifted the gears with it on jacks very slowly to make sure everything works.....knowing that, would you still recommend I stick with the collar that came out of it and just replace the bearing?

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The collar only holds and positions the bearing. The bearing does all the heavy lifting so replace it any time the transmission is out because it's hard to get at if it fails a month later.
 
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Pack the recess with grease. Put a small dab of grease where the clutch arm ends contact the release collar and one on the ball pivot on the transmission that the clutch arm rocks on.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Well I too am going through this issue. I have an L20b with an exedy 225 clutch. According to this thread http://www.the510realm.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=27619&p=239662&hilit=Throw+out#p239662

The distance from the fly wheel to the throw out sleeve tabs where the forks attach should be +/- 92mm. I measured my set up and I am just shy of 91mm so I should theoretically be good.

 

When I test fit my transmission (with slave cylinder removed) on to my engine the clutch arm has a little movement until the transmission is about an 1/8" from being tightened to the engine. When the tranny is completely bolted down there is no movement in the clutch arm so I am assuming the throw out bearing is resting on the clutch pressure plates and possibly applying some pressure. Is this normal or should I get the next shortest throw out sleeve which would be 8mm shorter?

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