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Blown RL411 engine


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#41 Datsun Dude

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Posted 15 October 2013 - 06:10 PM

I know it won't be the cheapest build, but that's OK. I'll let you know how it progresses.



#42 raceneely

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 07:41 AM

Kevin , where you at on this?



#43 Datsun Dude

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 01:31 PM

Kevin , where you at on this?


Hi Tom,
The car is at Z Car garage. The engine was supposed to be pulled this week and sent to the machine shop. I'll be down at ZCG on Sat. for a run to the Canepa Motorsports Museum, so I'll find out the real progress then. I'll let you know what I see.

Cheers and thanks for asking.



#44 Datsun Dude

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 01:21 PM

Engine still hasn't been pulled. It's in the queue, though. Should happen any time now. Can't wait!



#45 Datsun Dude

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 01:25 PM

the u20 wont fit without alot of work, trust me its on my list of things to do and ive done all the measuring and such for it....

 

BTW, over the weekend, while touring Canepa Designs, had some roadster guy say that U20 will fit, "no problem," as it's the "same size." I told him that, "it's different for the 411s," but he couldn't be convinced. LOL. 



#46 MikeRL411

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 01:28 PM

BTW, over the weekend, while touring Canepa Designs, had some roadster guy say that U20 will fit, "no problem," as it's the "same size." I told him that, "it's different for the 411s," but he couldn't be convinced. LOL. 

 

 

Let's hear it for "the hole in the wall" exhaust exit through the left front fender!  If that doesn't convince him that there is a difference, nothing will. 



#47 erichwaslike

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 01:53 PM

just ask him about the 2 different fan shrouds for a roadster, 1600 and 2000... then about the 411 that has no fan shroud since the fan is up against the radiator and the water pump block is already gone... theres just no room unless you redesign alot of stuff.


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but a debate between Down syndrome ingenuity > someone taking a shit in the gas tank
 

you read my post like a woman would, interpreting.... not actually reading.

wait skib loves the cock

Should I do it to myself or get skib to hammer me?

Ever hear that saying about people in glass houses Syncro?


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Take some time off, make your signature a little longer...everything will work out


 
 

 

i kind of want to be in your sig party/orgy

 

 

 

 



 
 

 
 

 

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#48 Datsun Dude

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Posted 29 October 2013 - 01:25 PM

just ask him about the 2 different fan shrouds for a roadster, 1600 and 2000... then about the 411 that has no fan shroud since the fan is up against the radiator and the water pump block is already gone... theres just no room unless you redesign alot of stuff.

 

Nice! It's funny when an old dude talks like he knows EVERYthing about everything related to cars. Wish I remembered this info at the time to put him back in his place.  :thumbup:



#49 exit64

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 06:12 PM

Coming to this conversation a little late.  Interesting stuff here.  FYI, to build out a stroker using a U20 crank will run you between about $2900-$3200 depending on how good your machinst is and what quality of gasket kits and pistons you go with.  For mine I had an extra U20 crank laying around so it cost me $150 to get the nose shortened  and a new keyway milled into it.  Also had to recut the threads for the bolt.  My block didn't clean up at 60 over so I sleeved it and had some custom Arias pistons built.  I spent quite a bit on a custom cam grind from Elgin, pushing $400 if I recall.  I built this motor for my 70 1600 but never got around to installing it. It will now live in my Dad's 67 early car that just came my way and get a 5 speed behind it.  If any of you guys swap in a 5 speed to an R16 keep in mind that you need to use the U20 back plate.  It is twice as thick as the R16 plate and will mess up the thrust if you miss this detail. You can also double up two R16 plates for true Ratsun style.  There is a boat load of information about building a stroker over on www.311s.org.  The fast and cheap way to do this is find an H20 motor and swap out the cast iron head for an aluminum R16 head.  Shifty has one it his car with Mikuni 44s on it and it is a pulling little beasty, right up until the cast head can't keep up with the carbs.  That will be rectified this winter with new head.

  I am throwing this out there so that you can get a handle on the "real" cost of doing this.  Not cheap to do it right but the gain is worth it in my opinion.  My 2000 with the U20 pulls great but the reality is at some point it will need a timing chain set for the tune of about $1200 for just the parts. 

Carry on.


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Ripping the Bring and sanding it round.

#50 Datsun Dude

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Posted 08 July 2014 - 09:03 AM

A little update. I just learned that 2 weeks ago the motor was pulled and is finally at Rebello. Going with an upgrade to larger pistons, etc. When I get the full work order, I can let you know more details.

 

At last!



#51 Datsun Dude

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 03:07 PM

Another small update. The motor is done at Rebello and back at Z Car Garage. It's taken months, but nice to know about some progress. Hopefully won't be too much longer to get the motor back in, make sure the brakes work, and other basics to get it driving safely.



#52 ppeters914

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Posted 17 February 2015 - 11:53 AM

Another small update. The motor is done at Rebello and back at Z Car Garage. It's taken months, but nice to know about some progress. Hopefully won't be too much longer to get the motor back in, make sure the brakes work, and other basics to get it driving safely.

 

Months? Heck, this thread started in Sept 2013!!!! :w00t: 

 

It'll be interesting to hear what work Rebello did and what it cost. I've heard nothing but good things about them, however, the words "cheap" and "inexpensive" were not mentioned.

 

The thread also never states if this is an SAE 3-main motor or Metric 5-main motor. As a '67, could be either. Hopefully, the later as the many of the parts, especially the main bearings, are readily available at lower cost than the 3-main stuff. What is the engine number? That should tell us.

 

FWIW, I pulled the 3-main on my '67 roadster to replace the clutch, replace the head gasket, do some general clean-up, and reinstall......yeah....right..... Full on rebuild pushing $2000. That's one reason I'm considering a KA for my 411 wagon.


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#53 Datsun Dude

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 03:17 PM

Months? Heck, this thread started in Sept 2013!!!! :w00t:

 

Crazy. Isn't it? I have a rather strange situation where I knew this would take a long timeā€”and that's totally OK with me. I just want to have it done right and by the right people. Doing it that way takes a ton of time and also money. I've needed the patience of a saint with this project, though.

 

In the mean time, I've totally built up my other car, a '93 300ZX N/A Slicktop: http://www.zcarblog....vins-300zx.html

 

I may have had better progress working on the project on my own, but I live in San Francisco and only have access to a carport. No way to leave a project lying about, unfortunately.

 

 

It'll be interesting to hear what work Rebello did and what it cost. I've heard nothing but good things about them, however, the words "cheap" and "inexpensive" were not mentioned.

 

I'm not sure what the final cost of the rebuild was. I haven't seen the final work order yet. I didn't spare any expenses in getting the motor rebuilt correctly and with performance in mind.

 

 

The thread also never states if this is an SAE 3-main motor or Metric 5-main motor. As a '67, could be either. Hopefully, the later as the many of the parts, especially the main bearings, are readily available at lower cost than the 3-main stuff. What is the engine number? That should tell us.

 

You know, I'm not really sure. Is the engine number the same number as the VIN? I can check the pink slip when I get home.

 

 

FWIW, I pulled the 3-main on my '67 roadster to replace the clutch, replace the head gasket, do some general clean-up, and reinstall......yeah....right..... Full on rebuild pushing $2000. That's one reason I'm considering a KA for my 411 wagon.

 

You're a lot smarter than I am. For sure.

 

I'll see if I can pin down a date for the reinstallation of the engine ASAP.

 

Thanks!



#54 ppeters914

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 04:04 PM

 

You know, I'm not really sure. Is the engine number the same number as the VIN? I can check the pink slip when I get home.

 

No, the VIN and engine number are different. The engine number won't be on the pink slip/title, but will be on the block (front right side) and a separate entry on the VIN plate, which should be attached to the left (driver side) fender inside the engine compartment.

 

datsun%20nissan%20plate.jpg

 

If the engine isn't the original, then the engine number on the VIN plate won't match. You can always call Rebello to get the actual engine number.


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#55 Datsun Dude

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Posted 11 March 2016 - 11:27 AM

Another small update. The motor is done at Rebello and back at Z Car Garage. It's taken months, but nice to know about some progress. Hopefully won't be too much longer to get the motor back in, make sure the brakes work, and other basics to get it driving safely.

 

A year later after I saw the motor. Looks like some signs of life on the 411 project, though. Carbs going to Z Therapy. Test fit for tires and wheels. More info to come.



#56 bananahamuck

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Posted 14 March 2016 - 05:15 PM

Good things come to those who wait.

 

 

:)


So somehow while i was driving back from Eaglerock swap meet i somehow caused YOU to post this,,,, do really think members on this site are that stupid to believe i caused it??

http://community.rat...un-for-a-while/

Yeah i guess you do,,

 

BTW ,,,, the first person to call you a pussy,,,, ya might wanna check out his ethnicity ,, cuz i don't think it's what you think it is there snowflakeboy

 


..........................I shall call it, narclops.

 

 

 


#57 MikeRL411

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Posted 14 March 2016 - 05:47 PM

No, the VIN and engine number are different. The engine number won't be on the pink slip/title, but will be on the block (front right side) and a separate entry on the VIN plate, which should be attached to the left (driver side) fender inside the engine compartment.

 

datsun%20nissan%20plate.jpg

 

If the engine isn't the original, then the engine number on the VIN plate won't match. You can always call Rebello to get the actual engine number.

 

I bought my RL411 from the self proclaimed number two factory authorized DATSUN dealer in the North American market. Grey market East Coast and Hawaii dealers not counted! Staley Motors, Great Falls Montana. He wanted to sell the RL411 especially with the British Borg Warner automatic transmissions for the wifey, but could not get specifics from Yokohama on just what modifications they were going to make to R type roadster 1600 engine to make it fit into the much shorter [vs the roadster] engine bay, so as a precaution he ordered 6 sedans and a spare engine!  This may be part of the explanation as to why the actual engine number does not always match the fender plate.  In order to make the customer happy and not take forever to service a warranty case, swap with the spare, make the customer happy, sell him/her another vehicle, repair the original engine without a time crunch and put it in the spare engine locker.  One happy customer and a carefully restored engine in stock.



#58 Datsun Dude

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 10:09 AM

Looks like engine is going in today at ZCG. Finally. :thumbup:

 

I was going to get a water pump over there prior to the installation, but the one that was on eBay got snapped up. I think it was the correct one but wasn't sure (old listing here). Radiator is going out for recore. Think he's got a clutch ready to go. Anything else I'm forgetting? Was running and driving prior to the engine rebuild.

 

This RL411 is sure to see some pavement soon!!

 

DD



#59 bananahamuck

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 03:57 PM

You have forgotten to post any pictures at all,,,,  in this whole thread..


So somehow while i was driving back from Eaglerock swap meet i somehow caused YOU to post this,,,, do really think members on this site are that stupid to believe i caused it??

http://community.rat...un-for-a-while/

Yeah i guess you do,,

 

BTW ,,,, the first person to call you a pussy,,,, ya might wanna check out his ethnicity ,, cuz i don't think it's what you think it is there snowflakeboy

 


..........................I shall call it, narclops.

 

 

 


#60 MikeRL411

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 05:33 PM

Looks like engine is going in today at ZCG. Finally. :thumbup:

 

I was going to get a water pump over there prior to the installation, but the one that was on eBay got snapped up. I think it was the correct one but wasn't sure (old listing here). Radiator is going out for recore. Think he's got a clutch ready to go. Anything else I'm forgetting? Was running and driving prior to the engine rebuild.

 

This RL411 is sure to see some pavement soon!!

 

DD

 

You can modify a Roadster 1600 water pump to retrofit an RL411.  The Roadster pump is about one inch too long in ther shaft and fan spinner and thus the alternator and lower crankshaft alignment.  So!  Pull the spinner from your RL411 water pump and press fit it to the shaft of the roadster water pump after pulling the roadster spinner!  This will leave an inch ot the rotor shsft protruding.  Options are to cut the shaft and put a slight bevel on the resulting edge to allow further assembly of the RL411 bell shaped spinner' or to pray that you have good rubber engine mounts.  I replaced my original rubber engine mounts when I did this swap many years ago and have had no problems!  The clearance between the end of the roadster shaft and the radiator core looks scary, but with good engine mounts to control the engine movement you should have no further problems.  A riskier option is to use a Ford Falcon upper pulley with appropriate spacer to align with the fan belt and a aluminum flex fan.  This will look scary given the radiator clearance and will require constant visual inspection to detect incipient stress fractures in the aluminum fan blades.