Car pulls left, right, left, right, left, right....HELP! Before i drive off the road...

[mantas]

Ok once again i have to start a thread since i have no clue whats going on. Did a disc brake upgrade and now the truck wanders from left to right. Steering wheel feels a little loose. When i turn the wheel might left wheel responds right away but the right wheel has play. The idler arm seems to wiggle a little but its so minimal that i'm not sure if the problem is a result of a worn arm. Below is a list of the parts that i have changed recently.

 

All replaced with new parts:

Outer tie rod ends

Center link

Sway bar links

Disc brakes (Upgrade)

Wheels 15x10

Tires

 

[datzenmike]

Toe is likely wrong. Straighten the driver's front wheel so it points straight ahead. Kneel down and sight across the sidewalls and compare to the rear tire. When it appears that the front and rear tires match and the front tire is straight,  go to the other side and they should also match. If the pass side tire is turned outward it will need adjusting in for sure. If it is pointing inwards, you should just barely be able to see it. If the inwards turn is quite noticeable it will need adjusting out. Vehicles always have a very slight inwards toe.

[mantas]

Toe is likely wrong. Straighten the driver's front wheel so it points straight ahead. Kneel down and sight across the sidewalls and compare to the rear tire. When it appears that the front and rear tires match and the front tire is straight,  go to the other side and they should also match. If the pass side tire is turned outward it will need adjusting in for sure. If it is pointing inwards, you should just barely be able to see it. If the inwards turn is quite noticeable it will need adjusting out. Vehicles always have a very slight inwards toe.

 

My alignment was done a few weeks before the brake upgrade, but the right wheel has wiggle room when moved from right to left if the car is jacked up or not. And since this is a 1973 620 i ended up buying non adjustable tie rod ends since i was told thats what it came with. Are there any adjustable tie rod ends that would fit my 620?

[datzenmike]

The tie rods don't adjust... the cross rod in the middle that connects them has L&R threads. Turn one way and both tie rods turn out, turn the other and they turn in.

[heretic]

check the tension rod bushings & torque them to spec. 12-16lbs for your truck. 

[mantas]

The tie rods don't adjust... the cross rod in the middle that connects them has L&R threads. Turn one way and both tie rods turn out, turn the other and they turn in.

 

I'll see if that helps tonight. Thanks.

 

The tie rods don't adjust... the cross rod in the middle that connects them has L&R threads. Turn one way and both tie rods turn out, turn the other and they turn in.

 

 

check the tension rod bushings & torque them to spec. 12-16lbs for your truck. 

 

Bushings are pretty beat, i'll see if autozone has them, might be worth replacing. 

[heretic]

that is what anchors the lower control arm in the correct position. If the bushings are badly worn, road imperfections will push the control arm around affecting the steering, ABSOLUTELY worth replacing.

 

Bushings are pretty beat, i'll see if autozone has them, might be worth replacing. 

[mantas]

It's definitely an idler arm issue. Nothing moves, tie rods are solid, control arm does not move but the idler arm goes left to right before the center link begins to move the other wheel - basically has play. Going to replace the whole thing and see. 

[mantas]

Figured out the problem after a short talk with the engineer at work. This guy used to be a racecar mechanic so he knows what he is talking about. Basically the sleeve for the idler arm was welded incorrectly. One of my ball joints must not be sitting correctly in the tapered sleeve so I'll be redoing the idler arm sometime this week, another $60 down the drain....

[MikeRL411]

$60 beats 2 hours in the emergency room!

[mantas]

Update....my autozone tie rod is crap. The taper is not the same as it is on the opposite side and in addition to that my damn idler arm is busted. With the correct tie rod it is much better but need the arm to make it work correctly. Oh well i guess it does beat 2hrs in the ER haha. Ive spent too many hours there anyways....

[mantas]

Well, i've been driving it for quite some time and the pulling right to left is still there. So i'm not sure what's going on, but i'm willing to bet it has to do with the front disc brake conversion. Anyone have any other ideas before i go for a tire balance and alignment to see if that helps?

[]2eDeYe]

Alignment would do it. Was the alignment done after changing all the steering components? or after you went to larger tires? Larger tires will change the toe sometimes depending on the increase. 

 

Best bet is to jack it up and move the tire through it's play and find the slack. 

King pin truck?

[DanielC]

Buried in the third post is 1973 620.  I think that is a kingpin suspension.

[mantas]

Alignment would do it. Was the alignment done after changing all the steering components? or after you went to larger tires? Larger tires will change the toe sometimes depending on the increase. 

 

Best bet is to jack it up and move the tire through it's play and find the slack. 

 

King pin truck?

 

Alignment would do it. Was the alignment done after changing all the steering components? or after you went to larger tires? Larger tires will change the toe sometimes depending on the increase. 

 

Best bet is to jack it up and move the tire through it's play and find the slack. 

 

King pin truck?

 

Kingpin it is, and no play anywhere, already tried that. The only play i had was the idler arm and that is changed now. Its not as bad on the highways, but on the streets when i hit a bump or a hole it pulls - i guess thats what you call bumpsteer? lol.

[]2eDeYe]

Buried in the third post is 1973 620.  I think that is a kingpin suspension.

 

Thanks, missed that :lol:

 

 

Did you get it aligned after replacing the idler? They really should have told you it was loose if you got it aligned before you replaced it.

 

If it was loose when they did the alignment, they would not have been able to align it correctly. I would take it back in and make sure they adjust the toe for your bigger tires as well.

 

If the front is still loose after replacing the idler you have another slack point, possible the tension rods. You should replace the tension rod bushings before re aligning it if they are bad or worn excessively.

 

 

I think it's probably a combination of to much toe out and worn tension rod bushings.

 

 

Edit, if you are really low your control arm angle can contribute to bump steer as well. Stock they are almost parallel with the ground, when you lower the truck it increases the angle of the control arm.  

 

_ _ _  stock

 

\_/ lowered

 

This effectively shortens your control arm length and causes it to travel in and out further than it normally would throughout it's range of motion.

 

 

 

I still think your toe is off though if it's wandering :)

 

 

[mantas]

Thanks, missed that :lol:

 

 

Did you get it aligned after replacing the idler? They really should have told you it was loose if you got it aligned before you replaced it.

 

If it was loose when they did the alignment, they would not have been able to align it correctly. I would take it back in and make sure they adjust the toe for your bigger tires as well.

 

If the front is still loose after replacing the idler you have another slack point, possible the tension rods. You should replace the tension rod bushings before re aligning it if they are bad or worn excessively.

 

 

I think it's probably a combination of to much toe out and worn tension rod bushings.

 

 

Edit, if you are really low your control arm angle can contribute to bump steer as well. Stock they are almost parallel with the ground, when you lower the truck it increases the angle of the control arm.  

 

_ _ _  stock

 

\_/ lowered

 

This effectively shortens your control arm length and causes it to travel in and out further than it normally would throughout it's range of motion.

 

 

 

I still think your toe is off though if it's wandering :)

 

 

 

This was helpful in checking a few things and, but i'm still wondering what in the name is wrong with this truck. Changed the tension rod bushings as suggested, checked all suspension links, seemed fine....went to align. Spent an arm and a leg for lifetime alignment (just in case i need it again) but this damn thing is all over the road still. I should mention it pulls rght when i hit the brakes and seems like my right wheel is harder to turn as opposed to the left. I have new bearings so it leads me to believe that the right caliper is probably sticking/locking and when i hit the brakes it compresses before the left has a chance.

[dgi]

Did you replace the flex lines when you did the disk conversion?

 

I recently had a similar problem with my DD.  Flex lines were cracking and deteriorating.  Hit the brakes and it pulled to the left then immediately back straight when the right caliper caught up with the left in pressure.  Replaced both flex hoses and problem disappeared.

[mantas]

Did you replace the flex lines when you did the disk conversion?

 

I recently had a similar problem with my DD. Flex lines were cracking and deteriorating. Hit the brakes and it pulled to the left then immediately back straight when the right caliper caught up with the left in pressure. Replaced both flex hoses and problem disappeared.

Both hoses are new. May be one of them was defective? Ill try to install some new control arm bushings for $10 its worth it. Then ill see if that does anything.

[]2eDeYe]

Put a pry bar to your suspension components, you should be able to find play that way. If there is no play then a caliper sounds like the culprit.

[mantas]

Put a pry bar to your suspension components, you should be able to find play that way. If there is no play then a caliper sounds like the culprit.

 

I don't have a pry bar but i do have a really long screw driver, i'll give that a shot tonight. I got my hands on another KA swap for about $290 and before i rebuild the whole damn engine and transmission i want to have confidence in the suspension and the brakes. Might even build the block to handle a turbo set up........ :sneaky:

[]2eDeYe]

Broom handle or a piece of pipe will work.

 

Nice price on that motor. :cool:

[mantas]

Broom handle or a piece of pipe will work.

 

Nice price on that motor. :cool:

 

Guy who sold it to me seemed legit and it came with an Autotragic transmission so you know that thing has had the least amount of abuse....LOL. The KA24DE sitting in the datsun is actually from a "drift" car.