sedan20 Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 i seem to be having other issues... its sputtering... i cant seem to figure it out.. i know that my fuel tank needs to be removed and cleaned because of the exposure it has experienced while sitting for so long with a broken fuel fill valve, but ive been installing new fuel filters regularly when an old one gets dirty... it started as a sputter ONLY when it got warm AND was under a load... i took it to a friend to check it out while i went back to the base for the work week... he said he set the weber carb to the specs that they gave him on the internet, and it seemed to run fine... but he just left it idling in his back yard without issue. i came back the next weekend, and test drove it.. it did the same thing while under a load and warm.. so we decided to see if there was an issue with a leaky intake manifold gasket being that the one installed had been on and off a few times. so we removed the intake and exhaust (in the process breaking one, drilling, and removing two, drilling, tapping, and helicoiling three intake/exhaust bolts successfully) re-installed flalessly, with copper coat. and while we were at it, installed my new dual side draft weber carb set up. it seemed to have the same exact problem. eliminating the option of it being a leaky/malfunctioning intake manifold/ carburator. also my new assy required fabricating some throttle linkage, so i jbwelded what i thought would work together, and let it sit for a day, i was able to use my new throttle linkage contraption for a day before it failed on me. ill have to come up with something else, tell then i throttle it from under the hood. BUT it was long enough to find that the sputtering problem has gotten worse, and is NOW affecting idle. just for shits and giggles i changed the spark plugs and regapped the new ones to oem specs. i wanted to know if it was related over fueling (i have an electric fuel pump hooked up in line to my weak mechanical fuel pump), so i turned off my electric fuel pump while it was sputtering, and it drained the carbs of fuel while sputtering the whole time till it died. seeming to me that it isnt an overfueling problem. now im stuck. ill check the spark today its a bit difficult to do solo being that cranking, and checking require you to be in two places at once. any advice would be appreciated. :mellow: i dont know carbs hardly at all, and points are gay :hmm: , i wanna get rid of those asap... i need more money. lmao. dont we all. Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 i wanted to know if it was related over fueling (i have an electric fuel pump hooked up in line to my weak mechanical fuel pump), should I comment on this or leave it along??????????WTF?????? what presssure is the electric pump? If the old mech pump works just use that. Thke the output hose sand point in safe direction and it will shoot alot of gas. Its alot! ck for spark. pull the center plug wire. place near ther strut hux nut on top with left hand. Use right hand to start 510 . and see if spark. Thats how to be in 2spots and SOLO. You could have a capicitor going bad or the bushing in the distributor is wearing out cause excessive side playin the shaft causeing it to prematurely open or close. Try regapping at a different size. and run it. With Electric conversions or a Matchbox distributor this is less liely to happen as you can have a little more wear in the bushing before you see this happen. PS if any coil was changed out other than stock value it could cause the points to burn up faster or arch under the cap Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 Dan Dalen If you did all that and it's acting the same, then I'm leaning towards dwell, coil, ignition cables. You can also run a hot wire to the coil and eliminate wiring. I have a dwell meter, spare coil and ign cables if you want to try them out.... You COULD have fuel flow problems under higher speeds, but usually, if you rip up to speed while the carb still has gas in it, and everything still acts the same, it's not fuel. If it's ok until the fuel bowl empties, then it may not be filling back up quickly enough under higher speeds.See More 39 minutes ago · LikeUnlike Andy Miller dwell is the gap in the points right? i have your tap and die set by the way dan... Mike, it would probably explain it a bit better if you saw this thread too...35 minutes ago · LikeUnlike Dan Dalen Yes, but more than the gap it's a measurement of how long the points stay open (or closed, I can't remember). Anyway, you can set the gap with a feeler gauge, but it's hit and miss getting it right.33 minutes ago · LikeUnlike Andy Miller damn it... did i mention i hate points? also... if the tank had been exposed to the elements for unknown amounts of time, do you think it would have brought in contaminants (dissolved tank linings) that could get past that fuel filter and affect its running? i know i need to either clean this tanks insides OR install a fuel cell, BUT i dont know if this is the cars sputtering problem...28 minutes ago · LikeUnlike· 1 Dan Dalen Does it always sputter at higher speeds? If so, it's probably not fuel flow. Because the carb will have gas in it for a bit before the demand exceeds the flow from the tank. It's a 2 minute test for the Dwell.23 minutes ago · LikeUnlike Andy Miller its not necessarily higher speeds, its a load in general... first gear, second gear... ive been saying it seems electrical the whole time, but the people who know more about these things seem to tell me its more fuel related.22 minutes ago · LikeUnlike Dan Dalen I agree with you. I would see if you can swap out the wires from the other engine. See if things change. Check the dwell, maybe swap the coil too. You could take it somewhere with a scope and they could tell, you, but swapping parts is free. :)15 minutes ago · LikeUnlike Andy Miller true.. the other wire set was toast (old and damn near solid) and this one is malible, but i dont know how old... maybe a new set is in the immediate future. i have no idea HOW to change dwell, but i was thinking of swapping out the coil and looking into electronic ignition anyway... i guess its a call to summit racing anyway... get my overnight parts from japan... errr... nevada.. lol12 minutes ago · LikeUnlike Dan Dalen If the dwell is off, you change it by widening or narrowing the point gap. It's not hard. Electronic ignition is a good idea, but it may not solve your problem if the coil or wires are bad, I'd do the check/swaps first and maybe save a few bucks.7 minutes ago · LikeUnlike Andrew Dalen How do the plugs look immediately after running? That'll tell you if your starving or over fueling.2 minutes ago · LikeUnlike Andy Miller good question. id guess that i need it to run to find out. HAHAHA!!36 seconds ago · LikeUnlike Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 i wanted to know if it was related over fueling (i have an electric fuel pump hooked up in line to my weak mechanical fuel pump), should I comment on this or leave it along??????????WTF?????? what presssure is the electric pump? If the old mech pump works just use that. Thke the output hose sand point in safe direction and it will shoot alot of gas. Its alot! i know it sounds wierd, but i installed the electric one inline after the mechanical one that was sitting for many years on the car in the woods... the pump didnt pull enough fuel to feed the origional carb, so i swapped installed the electric inline.. its a vintage "transistor fuel pump" i found it sitting on the passenger side of the car when i pulled it from its grave. the pump didnt work at first, but i smacked it against the concrete, and it started pumping.. i really should check it for a rated output, but i can say that after i installed it for about 3 weeks of commuting in this car (95mi drive) to work it ran GREAT... then the sputter happened. i figured that by having the mechanical fuel pump in line it would kind of meter the flow... idk... worked great till now... Quote Link to comment
ryknot Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 Sounds to me like you need to yank your tank. I had similar problems with my 620 and it was all becxause of shit in the fuel line, at the tank. There was fiel in the filter and the pump was pumping fuel as it should so by process of elimination figured it had yo be at the tank. It woukd run fairly well unti it was under load and then it would sputter and then die. I yanked the tank cleaned it and had it lined at the local radiator shop, works flawlessly now. 1 Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 i defintly need to do this anyway.. im thinking to check that by feeding it fuel from a 5gal fuel container... but yeah that tank HAS TO be cleaned. Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 you can ;look inside of the fuel filter(cut it open). if clean dont worry about it. As I said earlier if shoots alot of gas then that should be MORE than enough to feed the carb, carbs. do not use a fuel pump bigger than 3.5 pounds. Most are 7 at least and need to be regulated down. as for parts in the car Just because its free and lying in the dirt doesnt mean its meant its speced for that car Quote Link to comment
ryknot Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 you can ;look inside of the fuel filter(cut it open). if clean dont worry about it. As I said earlier if shoots alot of gas then that should be MORE than enough to feed the carb, carbs. do not use a fuel pump bigger than 3.5 pounds. Most are 7 at least and need to be regulated down. as for parts in the car Just because its free and lying in the dirt doesnt mean its meant its speced for that car When I did my tank, there was very little crap in the filter. There was enough shit blocking the fuel line at the tank that very little shit was getting through to the filter. If you have checked your fuel pump and its operating as it should, then the problem is at the tank. IMO. Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 lol. it wasnt laying in the dirt. the previous owner of my sedan was a nissan mechanic who died of cancer in 82. he had alot of plans for this sedan and left replacement parts in the masses in the car when it was put out of commission. all oem replacement parts from the dealership he worked at... age, and the elements destroyed most of the stuff there, but there were a few salvagable pieces, and of which, the fuel pump was one. when i changed the fuel filter several times the inlet side seemed to ooze this collected super fine sand/silt looking stuff.. thats when i would change the filter. ive been running chevron 91 octane in it till i get rid of this issue at least.... but i agree with needing a fuel regulator.... id like to eliminate the possibility of this issue completely. Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 only takes 20 seconds to look at the points and the bushing wear Quote Link to comment
ggzilla Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 clean your tank. you know you need to do it, and it is causing the sputtering Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 thanks for the input guys... ill be doing the tank today, and looking into upgrades in the electronics department as well... i called summit, and they said that they had electronic ignition conversions for UP TO the 69 model year 510... i asked about anything for my 70, and they said they didnt carry anything other than a $400 drop in mallory dizzy... i dont want to pay that much. do you have any other ideas for cheaply eliminating the points? Quote Link to comment
ggzilla Posted June 5, 2012 Report Share Posted June 5, 2012 Just get a stock Datsun matchbox distributor. It is high-energy. $40 at pick-n-pull (with matching coil) or about $125 fixed. Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2012 matchbox distributor? i guess i dont understand. whats that? Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted June 5, 2012 Report Share Posted June 5, 2012 read evervything in the general tech section asap SAVE THESE olddatsuns.com Jason gray write up read this!!!!!!! http://www.davidcmurphy.com/olddat/620tech.htm you never did ck the distributoer yet have you.? empty the tank and put more gas in it. I cant believe 2 sets up carbs have the same proplems of sputtering. Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2012 im not sure what your asking as far as checking the distributor. i took a look at it. i could tell it had one set of points, and that the part that connects looks worn. but idk... i havnt seen a new one either... i bought an electronic distributer on ebay, and am going to take the time while the car is down to remove the fuel tank and clean the shit out of it.. also im going to order a clutch assy and replace that being that mine is shot. Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2012 i saved the link tho. good stuff man. thanks! Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2012 alright, i dropped off the fuel tank at the radiator shop. it will be recieving several days of hot tanking, and then after a meticulous overhaul, it will be coated with some stuff thats supposed to make it last for another many years to come, and seal it of any pinhole leaks that may have been due to its exposure to the elements. i poured what fuel there was into the empty fuel tank of my lawn mower at 100% and into a gas can that was already half full (50% diluted) and when i got a picture of the two side by side they both had the same metalic/sandy appearance which makes me think that the contamination level was pretty high. below are pictures of both. BTW... the lawnmower runs... but it runs kinda funny. haha... i dont care, ill use the contaminated gas anyway... i have a warrantee. ALSO... i dropped the flywheel off at the local auto machine shop to be resurfaced, and possibly lightened (depending on price)... i weighed it, and it hit the scales at nearly 40lbs!! damn! im used to coming from the world of honda stuff. an eg flywheel weighs in at 18lbs from the factory, and quickly gets replaced under my care for one that hits like 11-15lbs from ebay. lol Quote Link to comment
Dirttrack510 Posted June 23, 2012 Report Share Posted June 23, 2012 Do you by chance still have points ignition? It sounds to me like your points or Condenser or both might be bad. You'd still get a spark and many times won't cause any problem till it warms up or is under a load to sputter if it's a bad condenser. I've had this issue on my daily driver and my race car both. Just my 2 cents... And if it's the problem it's a cheap fix. Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2012 i agree. it sounded electrical to me too, even though the mechanics around me blamed fuel.. growing up my dad always told me points were a horrible thing. i never knew why... but i trusted him, and on all the old mustangs and cougars my dad restored and flipped he changed the points to electronic ignition... so i never got to see WHY points sucked... till now. i bought an electronic ignition dizzy off ebay and plan on installing it before the gas tank is back in place. fingers crossed between the two issues being resolved the sputtering will go away... for good! Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 yesterday i finally started my 521 in 3 days. Before that it was rainy.I was sputtering like it was missing cylinders. I popped the cap and had condesation underneath it. Thi should always be the first ck. Ps I dont know why this computer starts out my sentanceses in the middleDamn computer or is it Ratsun? 1 Quote Link to comment
ggzilla Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 It's Ratsun. Ever since they upgraded the site a few months ago that's been happening. It's one of the buttons above where you type. It's worse the last two days since they switch hosts and it runs slower now. The page looks like it's loaded but it's not done so the wrong spots on the page get clicked. 1 Quote Link to comment
Dirttrack510 Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 Points don't really "suck", you just have to do maintenance on them and most people consider it to be a big hassle. I run points in my daily driver and I've driven it all the way to CA and back without an issue. Electronic Ignition is better though, as it provides maintenance free operation and a hotter spark. Points on the other hand require replacement about every 15,000 miles or so, after that they're toasted and MUST be replaced. 1 Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2012 im looking forward to as little maintenance as possible. i dont like suprise sputterings... lol... not my cup of tea... but ill keep my old dizzy(s) for the possible E.M.P.S!!! im all about EOTW prep. lmao. Quote Link to comment
sedan20 Posted June 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2012 im still happy to have eliminated an issue/potential issue with the gas... now its time to work the bugs/potential bugs out of the spark.... Quote Link to comment
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