Replaced timing chain and some gaskets and I can't get my L18 started again

[FiveSeventyZee]

I replaced the chain, the guides and tensioner and all the gaskets in my engine. I also had to change my camshaft out from a custom grind to a U20 cam. now I can't get it to start up. everything is back together and there is gas before the carb and the jets are squirting fuel. the spark plugs are firing in the correct order at a time close enough to run. I can only get it to idle if I hold the pedal to te floor. I feel like my fuel pump may have been damaged while I had it apart and now isn't making enough pressure for the carb. could that be it? anyone know what else it sounds like?

[ggzilla]

Sound like the timing is off. Re-check the mechanical (chain/gear) timing.

 

When you put a new camshaft in, you must not let it idle for the first 20 minutes. Run it at 2,000 RPM to ensure the cam sets in.

[FiveSeventyZee]

I'll check te mechanical timing tomorrow. and I couldn't get it up that high. also it's an old used cam just new for this engine

[datzenmike]

Set motor to TDC on #1. This should be done in a clockwise direction only. The motor can easily jump past this mark. If the motor goes past it, back it up well before and try again. This will assure a more correct reading.

 

When at TDC #1 look through the top hole in the cam sprocket. There is a small horizontal etch line in the cam thrust plate and a small Vee or U shaped notch in the back of the cam sprocket. The Vee must be directly below or just slightly to the right of the etch mark above it.

 

 

When you have this the crank and cam are properly timed in relation to each other.

[banzai510(hainz)]

watch this

 

 

why change the cam shaft is everything was set up for it.

set valve lash

Gas

fire order

cam timming

distributor timming

should start

[FiveSeventyZee]

the pin for the camshaft sprocket was broken on my cam and I didn't like the idea of just tightening it and using friction to rotate the camshaft.

 

valve lash is set,

gas is getting to the carb,

firing order is correct (1,2,4,3 right? that's what my manual says)

 

I've been working on the cam timing. I'm trying not to have to pull the radiator again so I've been moving one link at a time. I've been advancing the mechanical timing (setting the valves to open sooner) and I'm getting closer to drive able but it's not quite there yet. I think I'm one or two links away from the right spot. is there only one way it'll run well? I mean, if it's one link off will it make a difference? (I guess I'm asking how big my window is for the "right spot" I'm looking for is

[datzenmike]

the pin for the camshaft sprocket was broken on my cam and I didn't like the idea of just tightening it and using friction to rotate the camshaft.

 

 

 

Info that should have been mentioned earlier. Has this been repaired? how was it repaired? Because you may never get it right if there's a chance it might slip or if it was drilled out and another pin hammered in.

 

It will run within a couple of teeth but not well.

 

I don't see why this can't be fixed.

[FiveSeventyZee]

It wasn't repaired in any way, when I found that it was broken I pulled it out and put a new one in. I had 2 good cams lying around so it was easier than getting a new pin put in. and sounds good on the cam timing I'll keep going later today and try to get this thing back on the road

[banzai510(hainz)]

1 3 4 2 is the fire order.

 

That vedio didnt help?????????

 

line crank to Zero.

 

would have helped if you marked the chain in the 2 o clock position (when the cam) V was lined up.

 

watch vid. again

 

the first 10 min shows the cam timming V and Dash mark what to look for.

 

yes a link off it still should run

 

 

the part od I can only get it to idle when the pedal is floored is UNBELIVEABLE as if a carb plate is fully OPEN there is not enough vacuum to run it at a idle speed od say 700-1000 rpm. So maybe your explaining it wrong.

[FiveSeventyZee]

okay I've got the timing fixed (the v and the dash line up at TDC) and fixed the firing order and this was the result....

 

 

We thought it might be the plugs (they were pretty covered in liquid gas) so we wiped them down and we blew out the insides of the distributor with compressed air (lots of dust came out from the contacts) but it still just doesn't even really want to fire up. Anyone know what else it could be? I'm running out of ideas....

[banzai510(hainz)]

whats the deal with the hose from carb aircleaner(white 90deg elbow) going to the lower intake pcv valve. Thats wrong.

 

the 90deg elbow goes to the valve cover.

 

the crank case vent from block goes to the PVC valve in lower intake manifold, fix this. Got a Haynes manual? Its in there.

 

Make sure the valve lash is set.

Sometimes I get brand new spark plugs. But I assumed you cked the center coil wire to ground and get good SPARK?

 

It seems hard to turn over

 

 

Get a photo photo of this motor to see the hoses alot look HOKY on the hook ups. The the water heater line to intake and the fuel line.

 

You ever ck to see what the distributor timming was at TDC???????????????

[datzenmike]

Firing order 1342. Sounds like firing too advanced or wires are mixed up.

[FiveSeventyZee]

I'll fix the hoses but it ran like this when I drove it into the garage to do the timing chain....

 

valve lash is set, no I didn't check the distributor timing....how bad is that gonna set me back? and it seems hard to turn probably because we've been at this for a while cranking a lot draining the battery

[banzai510(hainz)]

Well that why I sent the vid hoping you cked all this stuff.

If electrical timming is off a tooth it will give a hard to crank situation as its fighting it.

 

charge batte ip and put motor on TDC and pull the cap leaving the wires hooked up. then pull the 10mm bolt holding the dizzy and pull it out. the spindal should be in the 11.28 postion looking at it. rotor should be right on the #1 plug wire in the middle on the timming plate travel slot on timming plate.

 

Yeah fix those hoses!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Cant believe people hook shit up like that

[FiveSeventyZee]

 

 

 

 

all shot at TDC. they all seem normal except the 3rd picture. shouldn't those little magnet things line up? am I off a tooth on my distributor?

[banzai510(hainz)]

Correct

all look OK except number 3 photo.

 

Just to make this simple loossen the distributor bolt and adjust it so its closer to lining up with the magnet tabs . and try to start it while holding the distributor with your hand (Mini C clamp)or find a vise grip to clamp it down for now. It should run better.

what could have happen is thwat soembody got a matchbox from a different L motor and the dizzy mount is different.

There were 2 matchbox types. with a slightly different clocking on 1 of them. To verify this is like what you have line up at TDC. and put the timming plate right in the center of the slot Put cap on for a second and look where the rorot is pointing. If between plug wire 1 & 3 then its a mount issue.

What most likely happen is they had the pump off a tooth to run it then you put it back in per the book and now it dont run right cause the privious owner is running a mistmatched part. Either you find another mount or just move it towards the number 1 plug wire.(drop the oil pump till it s right.) so it will be on # 1 plug wire and you have alots of Adv andd retart on the timming plate.

 

This is simple

[FiveSeventyZee]

Okay, thats what I was thinking but before it looked like they did line up. I was probably looking at something wrong though because I put the motor to TDC and took all 4 of those pics before touching anything. I'll try moving it one tooth and see how that does.

 

also just for clarification, because the distributor and the oil pump run off the same cog if one is timed the other is and if one is off they both are...correct? or am i missing something? sorry if this is a silly question i'm just trying to rule out any unknowns here because there is clearly something I'm doing wrong lol, it ran before now it doesnt, theres no reason I shouldnt be able to get it back to how it was before just without the timing chain rattling

 

 

also, why the part about holding the cap down with a c clamp or your hand? why not just the clips on the sides? do they not push down that hard and you're thinking my rotor isnt making good connections?

[banzai510(hainz)]

The C calmp is just a EZ sulotion just to trouble shoot. Just crank the dist over closer to where the magnet tabs line up. Clamp it down clip the dizzy cap abck on and run it hard. If runs good then the spindal needs to be moved to match up to the timming plate.

 

the holding the hand issue is

just hold the dist steady with your hand while you or your buddy get the car started. It should start ezer. You dont want to start it and the dizzy starts moving on you. But either way looks like the previos owner thought he has a deal on the Matchbox and forgot to grab the mount and the timming plate as a whole units and then you put the new chain set on and did it the correct way UNknowingly having mismatched parts.

[banzai510(hainz)]

datszenmike,GGzilla or soembody can take over as I dont have computer access much right now

[datsunaholic]

Honestly, at TDC the magnetic pickup should be about 10-12 degrees off. That's your static advance. That looks actually pretty close to 10-12 degrees.

 

Make dang sure you don't have the wires mixed up. Easy to do. It'll BARELY run on 2 cylinders if 2 wires are crossed.

[FiveSeventyZee]

I've been checking and rechecking the spark plug wires the whole time, 1,3,4,2 (right?) At this point I think we'll be checking it by moving it a tooth and hope it changes.

[datsunaholic]

1 3 4 2 Counter-clockwise, because that's the rotor rotation. Can't tell you how many times I've found #3 and #2 reversed.

[FiveSeventyZee]

Oh, good call. I Didn't think of that which must mean that's it. I'll check it when I get off work...at 2am...won't be starting it til the morning tomorrow

[ggzilla]

Yep, when setting the Distributor spark timing, you should turn the engine -- not to TDC -- but to the timing mark spec. Then line the teeth up by rotating the distributor (don't try to change it by "a tooth", just rotate the distributor, then tighten the bolt).

[datsunaholic]

Note for ggzilla's suggestion, if you do that ONLY turn the engine in the normal direction of rotation. While it's a worm gear, there's still a little backlash plus the drive tang is a loose fit so going backwards can throw the reading off by a couple degrees.