poopypants720 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Does anyone know the volume of the cylinder head per cylinder on the z22 head? Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 I do for the Z20E, Z22S and Z24. Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Also thanks to a conversation with kenturtles I've found I don't have much to worry about regarding valve clearance and with stock springs can get away with up to .555" of lift before they bind.I'm going for the ka pistons, 270° duration cam with as much lift as schneider can grind (hopefully at least .480"), port and polish on the head to meet headers diameter and at kens suggestion, going to see if I can get the valves back angle cut to 30° Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Wow, in search for the head volume I found some great info here on many motor swap stats.... http://www.newprotest.org/projects/510/jasonGray.pl Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 I do for the Z20E, Z22S and Z24.<br /> Awesome! Could you tell me the cc of the z22 head/combustion chamber? Do you maybe know the intake and exhaust port diameters as well? Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted September 22, 2011 Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 There are two chamber sizes. The most common are the Z22E (200sx)m Z22S (truck) and the Z24...I have done all three and a second time to check the results. I measured 57cc on all three. There is a smaller head used on the Mileage Option 720 with a Z20 S. (carb) It had 9.0 to 1 compression and the head volume I have worked out to be about the same as the open L head... about 45cc. Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 <br />There are two chamber sizes. The most common are the Z22E (200sx)m Z22S (truck) and the Z24...I have done all three and a second time to check the results. I measured 57cc on all three.<br /><br />There is a smaller head used on the Mileage Option 720 with a Z20 S. (carb) It had 9.0 to 1 compression and the head volume I have worked out to be about the same as the open L head... about 45cc.<br /><br /><br /><br /> Wow, really? Is that one of the 4 plug heads though or still 8? I think a smaller hemi head would be awesome.... And if 8 plugs not much in the way of distributor modifications or worries for failing visual inspection. Where was this head available? US, Ca, over seas? Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Btw, thank you for the volume amount ;) Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2011 Sooooo.... 8.44:1 compression... Any idea how many cc are lost by shaving the head 0.030mm? I can't believe the change in cr just from the change in deck height/compression height between the .05mm and 1.55mm.... A difference of 9.33cc.... I'd like to be in 9+:1 cr range if possible... But how to do that now is the question. Shave the block? Bad idea? Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted September 23, 2011 Report Share Posted September 23, 2011 Take the Z22 block and over bore to 89mm. This will allow the use of KA24E pistons. Use your Z22 rods if they are 145.9mm long or find L20B rods as they are the same. Yes the KA pistons have a negative 1.55mm deck height but this is good as the increased bore volume plus the smaller dish would have raised the compression too high anyway. This negative 1.55mm adds about 9.6 cc of volume to the combustion chamber so... Z22 bored to 89mm, KA24E pistons on Z22/L20B rods with Z22 crank and head will have a compression of 8.469 ... big friggin' deal. It'll work and you have a 2300cc motor when done. BTW the VG pistons have almost no dish (1cc) but have way too low a pin height ...negative 3.75mm over the stock Z22 pistons. If run in a stock bore Z22 (87mm) the compression would drop to 7.2 Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted September 23, 2011 Report Share Posted September 23, 2011 Any idea how many cc are lost by shaving the head 0.030mm? I'd like to be in 9+:1 cr range if possible... But how to do that now is the question. Shave the block? Bad idea? 0.030mm??? about 0.18cc. Did you mean 0.030" or 0.76mm?? That removes 4.725cc from the head and gives an 8.96 compression. 1mm removed from the head equals 6.2cc and gives a 9.12 compression. Removing material from the head or the block effectively adds slack to the timing chain. 1mm adds 2mm of slack. If your timing chain is old it may need to be moved to the next number up on the sprocket. Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2011 I did mean inches, sorry. I was caught up going back and fourth having fun calculating my own cr with a calcuator that required both in and cc, so I was converting all my mm-in.I would love to take off a full mm from the block just to get that cr but really don't want to deal with the timing chain issues... 2mm slack isn't something that can just be taken up by the tensioner? Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 26, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 26, 2011 So figure I should throw some pics in here of what I started with, progressed to and where I end up...Heres the cosmetic progression of the beast so far.... (just recently yanked the hood for practice and realigned to take out the gap shown in the pics) Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 26, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 26, 2011 And here was the state of the engine bay upon purchase.... And weber 32/34 dft before rebuild... Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 26, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 26, 2011 A pic of the carb without the air cleaner adapter Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2011 Also found I should be able to acheive the 9:1 compression ratio I was shooting for along with more displacement, along with a better breathing head, along with zero clearance issues and zero time chain modifications (getting a new one in my rebuild as it is ;) ). list of rebuild specs for my z22 are as follows.... -Bore over to 89mm and replace pistons with smaller dished KA24E truck pistons -Port and polish the head to give the clearest shot to the valves and better take advantage of my headers. -Port intake manifold to match new port on intake valves in head. -Back cut the valves to 30°. -Regrind the cam via Schneider Cams to the following specs: 270° duration, .480"-.490" lift, 114 Lobe separation. -check for initial need to mill head and block mating surfaces and shave off extra from head to .030" under stock. -replacing Weber 32/34 DFT with a Weber 38 DGES Should cost me just under 2g after everything... Am I crazy? Lol. Oh well will be fun. Already tearing down the motor for pulling... Will update with pics tomorrow.... And more questions... Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 Hmmmm.... Zero dish ka pistons??? Nismo part 12010-40F10(through 40F12 for different stages) 89mm flat top. 12010-40F72 bore of 89.5mm..... Wow... Don't think I want to bore that large. But its again another way to effectively raise compression without doing irreversable shaving to the block or head. Sooo im down to a bare long block sitting in my engine bay with the exception of the distributor and the intake manifold.... Except the intake manifold doesn't want to come off... A few of the bolts are impossible to get a 6 point socket onto and I'm worried that an open end wrench won't A) have enough leverage to break them loose and Bwill strip the heads... Especially since the most forefront lower intake bolt won't even come loose with a 6 point socket and breaker bar and is starting to strip. Pb blaster is no help in getting it unstuck either.... Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 Take the head off with the manifold on. Way easier. Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 I was hoping to be able to avoid taking off the head and just bring in the entire engine in long block form to the machinist.... I should prob take it off myself anyhow so I know exactly what's going on with so much oil being burnt right now anyways. And remove the cam for grinding so the machinist doesn't have to worry about waiting for it. Also the haynes manual is fairly vague regarding where the different hoist points are on the motor for when I go to pull it. Does the fsm have a better description or a visual diagram? I'm thinking I need to pick one up... In the meantime could I get a heads up on where the best mounting points could be? Quote Link to comment
poopypants720 Posted September 29, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2011 Thanks for the tip on just pulling the head mike. It made getting enough leverage and top weight onto that stripping bolt possible. Had to still pull all the other bolts first and do a lil wiggle on the IM to let lose all the rust seizing it. The threads were actually clean it was just in the manifold itself where it was locking up from corrosion. Also got a better look at the condition of my block and head... As far as the mating surfaces go and the cylinder walls, its not looking too bad at all...with my inexperience at this I can't tell anywhere that there was an obvious blow out of the head gasket. The thing that's got me worried is the gobs of white corrosion and rust coming out of the im water jackets and what's visible inside the head and the deck of the block.... All cylinders had very black tops to the pistons and the combustion chambers on the heads and valves were looking horrible too with tons of build up which isn't silo that apprising considering all the white smoke that always blew out and rate of oil consumption. Snapped a ton of pics... The one thing that tripped me out the most was the size of the water jacket holes in the top of my block... Heres some more of the block, head and intake This one show some black between cylinders 1 and 2... Is this from head gasket issues? Where can I get another, not rusted out fitting for this part of the manifold? IM gasket blew out at the water jacket under cylinder 2... Leaked when hot... Quote Link to comment
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