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My Ratsun Datsun 521


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#21 MicroMachinery

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Posted 15 April 2011 - 11:19 PM

This is great. I'm stoked to see that this truck isn't only going to not be parted, but is quickly becoming a very respectable runner. Randy would be so proud.

#22 DanielC

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Posted 17 April 2011 - 06:08 AM

On this page:

Engine put back in truck.

Matchbox distributor install, no pedestal, or timing plate.  Re-index oil pump spindle.

IR alternator install, and testing.

Big battery cables built, and installed.

Front end body work started.

Combo meter repair, and pinout connections.

Headlight current fusebox bypass relay.

Rebuilt taillights installed.

 

Friday afternoon, I decided I need to do something about the exhaust manifold. Only one bolt was there, holding the exhaust pipe on the truck. Of course, when pulling the engine, that bolt broke. So I went back to my in house parts supply, and pulled an old manifold off an engine that definitely needs rebuilding.
Friday late afternoon, and I need a gasket for the manifolds if I want to keep going on this project truck.
About 4:00 PM I call Clackamas Auto Parts, in Oregon City. Talk to Art, at Clackamas, and ask about the gasket for my engine. He says, I have to see what is available. I say I will call back in about a half hour. When I call, he gives me several options, and one is having a head gasket kit, Saturday morning.
I spent the rest of Friday evening taking the front end trim, and the bumper off.
I call Saturday morning, and at 8:34 AM, the gasket set is in my possession. I also get some wire, and I need to get a different belt for the alternator, the pulley in it is bigger, and it will not fit as close to the engine. I get two possibilities, and bring it all home.
So Saturday, I put the engine back together, and put it in the truck.
A simple statement, but it involved a lot of cleaning of parts, and time consuming boring stuff.
Cars do not go together in a half hour like they show on Saturday morning TV "Hot Rod" shows. The camera ia still in the garage, pictures later.



#23 alleycat

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Posted 17 April 2011 - 07:25 AM

:thumbup:

#24 DanielC

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Posted 17 April 2011 - 09:46 PM

Worked on electrical tonight. I got power to the ignition system, but the oil, and the ign light do not come on in the dashboard.
I am trying to figure out exactly is going on with the alternator wiring. the truck had no alternator when I got it. The truck also had an aftermarket oil, pressure gauge in it, and I can not find the wire for the oil pressure light switch.

#25 DanielC

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 07:32 PM

It runs, and it charges its own battery! Here is a picture of the engine as it sits today.
Posted Image
I did some work on the engine. I pulled it, cleaned a lot of gunk off it, put on a EI "Matchbox" distributer, and put in an internal regulated alternator that I have had laying around for several years.
The alternator charges about 14.5 volts, and put out over 30 amps, in the short time I ran the engine. I am running the engine briefly, because I have no radiator hooked up to it, yet. I plan on doing some front end body work on the truck, and the radiator would be in the way.
After a short run, I pulled the spark plugs, and did another compression test, this time with open throttle. #1, 177 PSI. #2, 168 PSI. #3, 162 PSI. #4, 169 PSI.
This is how I hooked up the coil to the stock wiring of the truck.
Posted Image
The red and black paired wires go to the coil plus, and minus. Red plus, in case you were wondering.
This is what I did at the distributer.
Posted Image
I took the tape off the original distributor wires, and found I could easily remove the wires I was not longer using. I used ring terminals at the coil connection, and put them under the spade connector on the positive side, and just put the black wire under the nut on the negative side of the coil. I then had only to put the temperature sender wire back into the harness, it goes beyond the distributor the the temp sender. I need to scrounge a junk yard, and find a factory distributor connector. For the details on electrical look around Ratsun. The information is there. Here is a clue. On the EI distributor, the terminals are labeled B, the first letter of the word "Battery" and C, the first letter in the word "coil". If you look below the distributor, you will see a black wire, under one of the small bolts that go through the head bottom surface into the front cover. This wire goes back to the spade connector by the vacuum advance, to ground the distributor.

This is how I timed the distributer. I set the engine about 12.5 degrees before TDC.
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Made sure I really was on number one cylinder, not number 4.
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I then put the distributor on the engine, and centered both timing adjustments. In my case, the rotor was pointing the wrong direction, and between two towers on the distributor cap. I dropped the oil pump, and turned the distributor drive spindle around until the rotor was pointing at the cap tower closest to the front of the engine. This is where my distributor drive spindle ended up to time my distributor correctly.
Posted Image

And this is where the distributor rotor pointed.
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That is my number one tower.
Posted Image

Then go counterclockwise around the cap, plugging in spark plug wires. 1, 3, 4, 2. Finally, I loosened the small bolt holding the distributer, and lined up the teeth on the wheel inside the distributer, to the pickup teeth, like this.
Posted Image

That is where my engine is currently timed. How many degrees before TDC, I do not know, but it runs, and I confirmed the EI distributer works. I do not want to run the engine long enough to check the timing, no radiator, yet.



Here is the alternator.
Posted Image
IR alternator hook up:
Ground the case of the alternator. I went back to the stock (I think) factory wiring for the charging side of the alternator. A short white wire going to the positive terminal on the starter, and the positive starter cable carries the current to the battery. Even though the old voltage regulator is removed, you must reattach the lug with the two black wires back to the body of the cab, where the old voltage regulator was mounted.
The IR alternator has two other terminals on it. "S" and "L". L is for the idiot Light. The light grounds through this terminal, and needs a switched ignition source supplied to it. The "S" terminal is where the alternator measures the voltage, and regulates to that. The "S" terminal needs to be hooked up to a switched battery voltage. Do not wire it directly to "always on" power.

I have some electrical problems with my truck. The key starts, and runs the truck, but no lights come on in the combo meter. There is the wiring needed to start and run the truck, that is working.

This is how I hooked up the two small terminals to test the alternator.
Posted Image
Again, I used a piece of red and black paired wire. The black wire in the pair goes to the "L" terminal, (it supplies a ground) and red wire goes to the "S" terminal. You can see then paired wires in between the battery and number three spark plug. The red wire, and test lead goes to the positive battery terminal. The test light ground clip also goes the the positive battery terminal. The probe of the test light is hooked up to the black wire, going to the "L" terminal on the alternator.

#26 wayno

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 08:46 PM

The alt. shouldn't put 30 amps out all the time, it will boil the battery. wayno

 

 


#27 DanielC

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 09:52 PM

I know the alternator should not put out that much current all the time, but I am only running the engine for brief periods of time. No radiator hooked up, yet.
I ran the engine briefly, without the "S" and the "L" hooked up. Did the compression test. Then hooked up the "S" and the "L" like I described, started it, watched the test light go out, indicating a charge, then put an ammeter in line, to check current output.

#28 DanielC

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 06:01 AM

A little slow on the updates. On Tuesday, I had to do some other errands. I also have a 1974 Ford F-250 Super Cab truck, that i have been putting scrap steel in over the winter. Parts of an old riding lawnmower, a door I replaced on my Aerostar, but mainly old wire fence, and metal fence posts I have been pulling out of horse pasture. Sold 940 pounds of steel for $98.70. While I was there, my poor Ford truck saw one of its brothers being torn apart.
My plan was to stop at DMV in Gladstone, to get the title changed. Of course, there were problems. It's DMV. A minor signature issue, on the wrong line of the old title. I am working on resolving that.
I also bought some new battery cable and wiring supplies, for a positive battery cable for Ratsun Datsun, the name I have given this truck, in reference to where it came from.
While I was out with the big fun to drive 390 4 barrel Ford, I also got a ton of wood pellets for the pellet stove I use for heating, from Coastal Farm in Oregon City, and mailed some bills I made out in the morning.
I unloaded the pellets, and then took a nap.
After the nap, I started to put the battery cable together. Here is a picture of part of the new battery cable I made, along with a new wire from the alternator to the starter.
Posted Image
I needed to so some serious work, so I mowed some lawn after that.
In the evening, I then went to do some body work on the right front corner. Took out the headlight holder, The turn signal.
This is a picture of the cover you remove to get to the nuts that hold the front turn signal on the truck.
Posted Image
and here is where it was in the truck.
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I also removed the side marker light.
Posted Image
This is a picture where the fender is "pooched" out a little from the front end of the truck hitting something.
Posted Image
While taking the lights off, I found sand inside the headlight bucket, and inside the back cover for the turn signal, and packed in the space between the radiator core support, and the front panel. There was also a lot of sand on top of the headlight bucket, inside the top front fender.
Posted Image
That was only some of the sand. There is a lot more.
It was not a case of simply unscrewing the screws that held the lights on the truck. Out of four screws holding the headlight mount on, two broke, and one had to have the head drilled off. One screw came out without breaking.
The side marker light had one bent screw, as did the front turn signal, holding the lens on the light. Both lights are rusted pretty bad, and the bulb would not come out of then without breaking the bulb.
To finish removing the front turn signal, I had to remove the cover on the inside of the fender that keeps mud away from it. One of three screws came out, one had to have the head ground off, and one I was able to remove by moving the cover, once the other two screws were removed.

#29 thisismatt

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 06:15 AM

You can't force current onto anything that isn't drawing it. An alternator only puts out the current that is asked of it, so if it's putting out 30amps that's because something (battery, a short, accessories) is drawing 30amps. You can over volt the battery, however.
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#30 banzai510(hainz)

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 06:44 AM

I assume you jumpered the where the old volt reg connector plugged into.Since this is a IR alternator

http://datsun510.com...&papass=&sort=1

If this is a big alternator i cant see why not it makes 30amps at idle
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#31 DanielC

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 07:21 AM

It is a 50 amp alternator. When I checked the amperage it was putting out, it was after I did a compression test on the engine. That probably drew the battery charge down a little bit. Because of that, I expected a fairly high charge rate. Because I do not have the radiator on the engine yet, I need to do some body work on the front end of the truck, I do not run it long enough to see if the current drops.
Hainz, Thanks for the link!
When I did the amp test on the alternator, my "IGN" light on the dashboard was not working. I just used a test light, between the positive battery terminal, and the "L" connection on the alternator, and in a similar fashion, used a second test lead from the battery positive to the "S" terminal.
Here is a picture of the setup I used to test the alternator.
Posted Image

#32 banzai510(hainz)

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 07:39 AM

most people jumper at the square connector. just make 2 jumper wires and go by the color code on engine side of the harness.

You can cut a bad volt reg and jumper it there also so it look more professional and you can go back to stock but dont go by the color codes on the volt reg as I seen them are colored wrong soemtimes.

I think this shold get your light going when you install the jumpers.


I had a Mitshibitshi alternator ones and it had a T connector ADAPTER. I dont know if this will pertain to you. But it came with a Mitshibishi rebuild once I had.

GGzilla had a drawing on how to ck a alt out put. Put I cant post photos.
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#33 DanielC

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 08:39 AM

I forgot one other thing I did on Monday, April 18, 2011 (full date for my future reference)
I pulled the combo meterout of the truck to see what was wrong with it. First clue, no lights on it anywhere.
Here is a picture of the back of the meter.Posted Image
First thing, what do the pins hook up to.
Posted Image
I had to clean the contacts on the circuit board, the contacts in the bulb holders, the bulbs themselves. Here is a picture of one of the lamp holder holes, half cleaned. I used a Scotchbright abrasive pad to clean the contacts. In this picture, on side is cleaned, the other is not.
Posted Image
I also had to repair some grounds on the circuit board. the circuit board does not have a full copper trace for the grounds, but uses the metal case, and rivets through the circuit board to complete the grounds. To repair the grounds, I had to bridge the head of rivet to the trace on the circuit board.
Posted Image
Then I had to test the combo meter.
Get a 12 volt battery, and hook the negative up to pin 10.
Apply 12 positive to pin 1, the four dash lights should turn on.
Apply 12 positive to pin 2, the left turn light should turn on.
Apply 12 positive to pin 9, the high beam light should turn on.
Apply 12 positive to pin 12, the right turn light should turn on.

Apply 12 positive to pin 7, and ground pin 4, the oil light should turn on.
Apply 12 positive to pin 7, and ground pin 8, the IGN (alt) light should turn on.

Apply 12 positive to pin 7 and ground pin 10, and also ground pin 3, the fuel gauge should go to full.
Apply 12 positive to pin 7 and ground pin 10, and also ground pin 11, the temp gauge should go to hot.

This was on April 20.
So now, I had the combo meter working, plugged it back in to the truck, and still no ING, or OIL light. I took a long piece of wire, with a spade connector on it, and plugged it into the voltage regulator plug, on the white wire, with the red stripe. I pulled the end of the wire to the hole on the dash, where the combo meter was, and found the white wire, with the red stripe, ahd used an ohmmeter to see if ther was a connection. There was not.
Then I went under the glovebox, and looking up, I could see these connectors.
Posted Image
I found the connector that had the white wire, with a red stripe, unplugged it, and one side of the connector went to the combo meter plug, and the other end of the connector went to the voltage regulator plug. I plugged it back in, and rechecked the continuity from the voltage regulator plug back to the combo meter plug, and had continuity. I then jumpered across the voltage regulator plug like people on Ratsun said, and I had the IGN light working.
While poking around the wiring by the fuse box, I found a short wire taped off, whth a piece of paper in it. I pulled the paper out, and it had written on it, "oil pressure switch" I spliced a longer piece of wire to it, and hooked it up to the oil pressure switch, and the oil light on the combo meter now works.

Almost anyone who has a 521 for any length of time has had a problem with the headlight fuse, and the fuse box. There must be a reason the 510 uses two headlight fuses.
I did a "quick and dirty" easily reversible relay modification on this truck.
Here is a picture of an extra in line fuse holder I added to the fuse box>
Posted Image
The end of the orange wire hanging off in space will go to this extra relay, pin 30.
Posted Image
And here is another picture.
Posted Image
This extra relay is hooked up as follows.
Pin 30 gets power from the the added fuse.
Pin 87 goes to the terminal on the stock headlight relay that has the red wire with the yellow stripe on it, with a short jumper.
The red wire with the yellow stripe goes to pin 86 on the new relay
A short wire to ground goes to pin 85 on the new relay.

This additional relay takes headlight power out of the stock 521 fuse box. The headlight power also has to go through some connectors, the headlight switch, and into the cab, and back.
This is the voltage drop in the headlight positive side before the relay was added.
Posted Image
And this is the voltage drop after the additional relay.
Posted Image

After playing with electrical, I decided to remove three broken studs off the bottom of the old exhaust manifold.
Just you basic cut off the broken stud flat, centerpunch it, and drill it out. Then chase the threads with a thread chase tap.
No before picture, but here is the manifold ready for new studs.
Posted Image

#34 DanielC

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 10:22 PM

Had other things happening today, but I did remove the fuse box, and cleaned it a bit.
I also drilled out two of the three broken off screws for the right side headlight holder.

#35 Suspect

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Posted 22 April 2011 - 06:43 PM

looking good, wish I could have been able to do something with the 521's I had. I gave the first one away because I thought I'd never find another one. So I got rid of it and less than a year later I got another one. I sat on that for a few years and never found enough parts to put it together so I traded it for a 620.

#36 DanielC

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Posted 22 April 2011 - 08:37 PM

Today, I did something a little different.
The right front used to look like this.
Posted Image
Now it looks like this.
Posted Image
Here is the other side.
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And a slightly different view.
Posted Image

#37 blackdeth666

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 12:12 AM

I just redid the front of my 521, I swear more bolts broke off than actually unscrewed! Looks like your well on your way!

#38 DanielC

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 05:52 AM

I'm well on my way of having to buy more bolts. I am learning the fine art of drilling out broked bolts, and screws, and retapping the holes.
It is also good a 521 uses SAE standard American threads for the body bolts. I am also getting good use out of taps my father had.
Here is my general procedure for removing bolts. Wirebrush any exposed threads on the end of the bolt if possible. Spray penetrating oil on it, and let it sit. Try to remove the bolt. it it starts to turn, and then gets difficult to turn again, spray more penetrating oil, behind the head of the bolt, and screw it back in.
If I can, I use this electrolysis process to try to eliminate the rust first.
http://community.rat...h__1#entry40613

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 05:52 PM

I'm well on my way of having to buy more bolts. I am learning the fine art of drilling out broked bolts, and screws, and retapping the holes.
It is also good a 521 uses SAE standard American threads for the body bolts. I am also getting good use out of taps my father had.
Here is my general procedure for removing bolts. Wirebrush any exposed threads on the end of the bolt if possible. Spray penetrating oil on it, and let it sit. Try to remove the bolt. it it starts to turn, and then gets difficult to turn again, spray more penetrating oil, behind the head of the bolt, and screw it back in.
If I can, I use this electrolysis process to try to eliminate the rust first.
http://community.rat...h__1#entry40613

Damn Mang!!!!! way to put in work!!! don't forget about discount import parts or baxters for datto parts if you go to baxters tell them to put it on the northwest Z account for a discount

#40 DanielC

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 08:17 PM

Thanks for the tip on NW Z cars. I Think I still am current with Datsuns NW. Need to find out, and get my card.

I have been working on the little lights, the headlights seem to be working good, since I added the relay. See post I made in this thread, April 21.

The taillights. They looked like this.
Left side. Notice the fiberglass holding the turn signal lens.
RatsunLfTaillight.jpg

Right side. Look closely above the last "9" on the license plate, and you will see the remains of a bracket that held a socket for trailer electrical. Luckily all the trailer wiring was done on the taillight harness, and not on the harness for the truck. But it was a mess.
RatsunRtTailight.jpg

The back up lights did not work in either taillight assembly, and the turn signal bulb in one was a low watt incorrect bulb, for the turn signal.

The left side taillight was held on with bolts and nuts in all four corners. It came off the truck easy. The right side, not so much. The two inside screws, had nuts on the back, and I was able to hold the head of the screw with a pair of vice grips, and turn the nut off with a wrench, after an overnight soak with penetrating oil. The lower screw on the outside, same idea, but the screw broke. The top screw on the outside, screwed into a welded on nut on the bed. That screw had to have the head of the screw drilled off, and then the remaining screw parts drilled out, and then chase the threaded hole with a tap. (size, 10-32)

A while back, I did a write up on repairing 521 taillights. That write up is here:
http://community.rat...ght-rebuilding/

 


Now, the fun part. Go grab a right and left taillight from my stash of 521 parts, and bolt them on.

left side,
RatsunLfnewTaillight.jpg

Right side.
RatsunRtnewTaillight.jpg
The taillights were tested on the bench, before I put them on. The fuse box is currently out of the truck, so I haven't tested them on the truck, yet.

Next up, the side marker lights. The left rear one was gone. The other three did not work.
Unfortunately, I do not have a stock of clean, working ready to go marker lights. I do have some parts, but nothing complete.
I am having to clean rust off the ones that were on the truck.