Pacific coast Datsun Posted May 7, 2009 Report Share Posted May 7, 2009 Ive now succesfully swapped 3 of my Datsun's from points to electronic ignition & wanted to do a how to than even the garage mechanic [me included] can do. This writeup will cover the "matchbox" distributor coupled with an electronic ignition coil [bigger] which is the easiest in my opinion. Keep in mind i did this swap on my 72 510 wagon & wiring harness colors may vary from car to car/truck but the concept is the same. 1. you want to set the engine to TDC [top dead center] compression stroke BEFORE removing the points dist. Remove #1 spark plug [closest to radiator] & insert a screwdriver into the opening so that it's flat [level with the ground]...turn the fan or crank bolt until the piston rises up & touches the screwdriver...remve dist. cap & see if the rotor is pointing to the #1 plug wire...also if you want remove the valve cover & see if the #1 piston cam lobes are in the 10 & 2 positions [pointing up]....if so your @ TDC compression stroke. If the rotor isnt pointing @ the #1 plug wire continue to turn crank/fan until the piston comes up again & points to #1 plug wire. 2. Remove the 2 10mm bolts @ the pedestal & the wires attached on the side of the dist. body then remove the points dist. The end of the oil pump drive gear should be in the 11.28 position like this . 3. Remove the wires from the ballast resistor & coil & take out of vehicle. 4. Install new dist. & spin rotor until it drops in place. Now look @ where the rotor is pointing & this will NOW be the #1 plug wire location on the cap. The other plug wires will go COUNTER CLOCKWISE & the firing order is 1-3-4-2. 5. Install new EI coil. 6. The matchbox has 2 prongs on it & are labeled B & C. Youll need to make new wires that run from B & C on the matchbox over to the EI coil. B goes to the + [positive] & C goes to the - [negative] side of the coil. Youll also connect the black w/ white stripe wire[used to connect to the ballast resistor] on the + terminal on the coil. 7. The dist. has a 10 mm bolt that secures it to the pedestal & allows the dist. to be moved side to side to set the timing. For the initial start up i put the 10 mm bolt in the middle. Use a timing light to properly set the timing but you can get it to run ok by ear. 8. Install NEW plugs & gap them anywhere from .040 - .044 OK thats about it as far as "hooking things up". The remainng wires not being used can be zip tied out of the way. Heres a few pix of the setup......... the black wire is B & the orange is C. The 2 wires on the bottom of the pic used to be connected to the points coil [not needed now]... black & black/white wire going to + & orange going to -. wires below it used to attach to the resistor & points coil... I realize theres a few different ways to swap over to electronic ignition & im not claming to be a mechanic but this is the way i did it & it was very simple & works great & i wanted to help out my Ratsun brothers...:cool: 1 Quote Link to comment
ggzilla Posted May 7, 2009 Report Share Posted May 7, 2009 As easy as 1,2,8. I've done the same swap for Datsun A Engine and indeed it is very easy. I like your screwdriver method. I would only add: Remove battery cable before step 1 to remove the remote possibility of the engine firing or sparking while performing any of these steps. Quote Link to comment
Pacific coast Datsun Posted May 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2009 Good advise..my battery was unhooked at the time & forgot to mention. TY sir. Quote Link to comment
datto510 Posted May 7, 2009 Report Share Posted May 7, 2009 Thanks for the write up PAC! Its so easy when you write it all out.:D Another thing for my "to do" list! Quote Link to comment
AZhitman Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 Nicely done! Quick question, and I'm sure it's been asked before... For those of us who are familiar with the old stuff, what are the most common "donor" cars (year and model) for the correct dizzy and coil? For reference, I'll be doing this on my '67 PL411 wagon. Quote Link to comment
Pacific coast Datsun Posted May 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 Nicely done! Quick question, and I'm sure it's been asked before... For those of us who are familiar with the old stuff, what are the most common "donor" cars (year and model) for the correct dizzy and coil? For reference, I'll be doing this on my '67 PL411 wagon. Good question. I got EI distributors from a 76 610 & a 77 620 KC. Both used the remote ignitor box & i used the HEI module on those. The dist. in my wagon was a gift & im not sure what vehicle it came out of. Some of the newer Z & ZX's ran EI & even though the dist cant be used [6 cyl.] the coils can be so finding parts is made easier. Ive even seen early maximas & 310's run a matchbox dist. Is your 411 a J motor? If so Mklotz did a writeup explaining how to mod the drive gear on a L dist. so it works on a J or E-1 motor. Quote Link to comment
Z-train Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 I actually know idiots that say points are superior:rolleyes: None on this board that i know of.:mellow: Quote Link to comment
AZhitman Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 Now, what's the advantage to doing this, over, say, simply installing the Pertronix kit? Quote Link to comment
Phirus Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 ...turn the fan or crank bolt until the piston rises up & touches the screwdriver... [/b] Dunno if it's common, but my fan has a centripetal clutch. Quote Link to comment
Phirus Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 I actually know idiots that say points are superior:rolleyes: None on this board that i know of.:mellow: If it's not broke, don't fix it. Is there really any reason to switch to electronic? Quote Link to comment
AZhitman Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 Absolutely. Fuel economy, performance, reliability... My NL320 came ALIVE when I switched out. More power, quicker starts, smoother idle, and better overall driveability. Quote Link to comment
Phlebmaster Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 Good advise..my battery was unhooked at the time & forgot to mention. TY sir. Nice write up Mark! Have you ever been hit by an HEI coil?? I was the other day and wowzers....I tingled for an hour. :eek: Quote Link to comment
hang_510 Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 Now, what's the advantage to doing this, over, say, simply installing the Pertronix kit? it may be cheaper to get a complete E-dizzy than the kit... assuming you have a single point (pertronix doesnt fit on a dual point) after they're installed... none really :) Quote Link to comment
ggzilla Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 If it's not broke, don't fix it. Is there really any reason to switch to electronic?Yes, points "break" after a while. The owner's manual says to replace them every 12 months. Or you can change to EI and never change them again. No adjustment ever. Only set the timing once instead of every 12 months. These modules are now 30 years old now, and still rarely go bad. But certainly you can just replace the points every year or two. That works too. The matchbox distributor is 1978-up. 76 & 77 used the external EI module. Quote Link to comment
Phirus Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 Absolutely. Fuel economy, performance, reliability... My NL320 came ALIVE when I switched out. More power, quicker starts, smoother idle, and better overall driveability. First time my truck fails to immediately start I'll get to work on it.. 1 Quote Link to comment
jonesy510 Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 i actualy was just talking about doing this with my friend and i was wondering how much did the whole thing cost you?? im putting an l18 in my goon right now and was thinking of also goin to EI while im working on the motor Quote Link to comment
Z-train Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 Now, what's the advantage to doing this, over, say, simply installing the Pertronix kit? Steady timing.Points bounce.When points bounce dwell changes.Dwell changes-timing changes.Timing changing is not good. As far as the E-distributor Vs. Pertronix goes,you have Datsun quality vs.after market add-on with questionable quality. Quote Link to comment
ggzilla Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 how much did the whole thing cost you??$45 -- $35 for the matchbox distributor and $10 for the matching coil. It is not required that you change the coil, but if you do, you can remove the Ballast Resistor and get a stronger spark. The distributors cost anywhere from $25 used to $175 for completely rebuilt less the box (say at RockAuto.com). Quote Link to comment
jonesy510 Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 so basically buy a coil and distributer and wire it in to summarize everything?? haha sorry i have done motor things but never messed with timing or ignition before so all this is kinda new to me :D Quote Link to comment
tlap Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 Jonsey510, since you are local, if you want, PM me and come over, I have done this on my L20. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 (edited) .... what are the most common "donor" cars (year and model) for the correct dizzy and coil? There are two types of EI dizzys. Remote and matchbox. They work the same but the matchbox has the remote igniter box miniaturized and mounted on the distributor side so it is easier to wire up... and looks neater. The remote igniter box is usually mounted inside the car under the dash and has 5 wires to connect up. Here is a remote dizzy: http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/EIdizzyremoteigniter.jpg[/img]"]and the remote igniter box... http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/Nissan%20Electrical/DatsunEI007Large.jpg[/img]"] Here is the matchbox type: http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/Eidizzy.jpg[/img]"] http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/Nissan%20Electrical/DatsunEI005Large.jpg[/img]"] The L 4cyl remote igniter box and matchbox dizzys are found on: 200sx remote '77-'78 Calif. all others '78 only, matchbox '79 all. 510 (HLA10) remote '78, matchbox '79 610 remote '75-'76 Calif only. 620 remote '76-'78 Calif. all others '78 only, matchbox '79 all. 710 remote '75-'77 Calif only. 720 matchbox '80 only. Note: The '80 (and '81 in Canada) 200sx with the 4 plug head NAPS Z20E, and the '80 HLA10 4 plug head NAPS Z20S engines used a similar matchbox dizzy that will fit and work on the L engine if you use the L pedestal. 280z/zx non turbo dizzys can be converted over to use on 4 cyl engines if you swap in the 4 cyl reluctor (remote) or reluctor and stator ring. (matchbox) Take note that some or all 280z/zx may have a double plug on the EI matchbox module. A guy on the Realm reported a dizzy that retarded the ignition timing as the RPMs went up when using the dual plug module. This may be part of the EFI timing retard for emissions or spark knock control. Here is a picture of my L24E dizzy with the dual plug: http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/Nissan%20Electrical/DatsunEI003Large-1-1.jpg[/img]"] Absolutely. Fuel economy, performance, reliability... My NL320 came ALIVE when I switched out. More power, quicker starts, smoother idle, and better overall driveability. Economy and performance... maybe a bit better because of the better spark. A well maintained points system will work about as well. But that is the point, (pun intended) points are only good when regularly maintained to keep them good. They wear and the wear changes the dwell and the timing. The Nissan (or perhaps Pertronix) EI does away with points, so NO replacement, adjustment or maintenance. Reliability. They work as good now as in ten years time. Set 'em and forget 'em. If you suspect an ignition problem check the wires, cap, rotor, coil, timing or loose wiring. The last thing you check is the dizzy. Note: If converting from points to EI dizzy it's best to re-gap your plugs from the usual 0.032 to 0.038-0.042" to take advantage of the increased spark voltage available. A wider gap will present a longer length spark to fire the cylinder. A points system would be hard pressed to fire a 0.040" plug gap at full throttle/high RPMs! Edited May 15, 2009 by datzenmike Quote Link to comment
jonesy510 Posted May 16, 2009 Report Share Posted May 16, 2009 T i will pm u wen im ready but it probably wont b for awhile. i wanna get my motor in and running well before i mess with the ignition. Quote Link to comment
jonesy510 Posted May 18, 2009 Report Share Posted May 18, 2009 so i dropped the motor and in order to get it running i had to wire in the coil for EI. the distributer is getting power but no spark the distributer is suppose to b have been refurbished. anybody have any ideas?? Quote Link to comment
ggzilla Posted May 18, 2009 Report Share Posted May 18, 2009 Wiring is incorrect? The blue wire goes to + side of coil. The other wire to - side of coil. That's all there is to the 'matchbox' wiring. No condensor is needed. Will a Z24 distributor fit L-series engine from Nissan 720 pickup? PaP had a couple yesterday. They also had an L28 distributor but both the vacuum advance diaphragm and the advance bearing plate it in were shot. I was thinking of getting it and swapping the 4-cylinder stator and inductor. Quote Link to comment
jonesy510 Posted May 18, 2009 Report Share Posted May 18, 2009 i switched the wires and nothing i have one wire running from the c to negative and one running from positive to the b like the write up says. i also have the black and white wire running from the battery to the coil as well. i tested to c if the dis. is getting power and it is soo.... yea im completely lost.. is it possible to fry the matchbox??? Quote Link to comment
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